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Iowa State 44, Iowa 41 (3OT): Jantz Jantz Revolution

* Just like the bad old days.  If I hadn't seen Paul Rhoads punching himself in the dick to celebrate this win after the game, I would have sworn Dan McCarney was still roaming the Iowa State sidelines because this was a Danny Mac special.  A fired-up team flying around the field with emotion and intensity oozing out of every pore?  That executed at a higher level than previous evidence suggested was possible?  I have seen this script before.  I didn't like it then and I like it less now.  After the beatdowns of the last two years, we assumed that Ferentz had "figured out" the ISU rivalry, but yesterday's loss undid that progress in spectacular fashion.  Ferentz's inability to consistently prepare Iowa for games is a frustrating mystery.  He's remarkably good at bowl prep (ever since the '03 Orange Bowl) and consistently has Iowa raring to go against many upper echelon Big Ten teams (Penn State, Michigan State, Michigan for the most part, etc.) but he consistently fields flat teams that struggle to match the focus, passion, and intensity of "lesser" opponents like Iowa State, Northwestern, Indiana, etc.  If he can't solve that mystery, Iowa's doomed to continue to endure losses like this year in and year out.

* Steele Jantz outplayed James Vandenberg.  Raise your hand if you thought that would happen.  Outside of the mouthbreathers at Cyclone Fanatic, I don't think anyone thought that was even a possibility.  We praised Vandenberg after his solid performance in miserable conditions last weekend and he got off to a good start again here: he went 6/8 for 78 yards and a TD on Iowa's first two drives, which led to ten Iowa points.  Then he went 10/20 for 129 yards the rest of the way.  We just ended a three-year relationship with a bipolar quarterback, but it looks like we might be replacing one bipolar passer with another because this game was full of Good Vandy and Bad Vandy.  Good Vandy showed up early and was stellar: the pass he dropped into Davis' hands down the sideline, the touchdown he threw to Martin-Manley and the pass he threw to Fiedorowicz were very well-thrown passes.  But Bad Vandy spent a lot of time on the field, too: he also threw more than a few downright hideous passes.  Iowa needs to see a lot more Good Vandy going forward.

Star-divide

On the other hand, Jantz was simply superb: 24/36 for 271 yards and 4 TD (and zero INTs), along with another 36 yards on the ground.  And those numbers don't come close to conveying the ground he covered while scrambling around to elude Iowa's defense (PAIN PAIN PAIN).  Nor do they describe how inch-perfect some of his passes were, something no one would have forseen after his performance against UNI a week ago.  Iowa State fans have been comparing him to their last great quarterback, Seneca Wallace, but yesterday he had more in common with a former Iowa quarterback: with his fancy footwork to escape defenders and knack for making big plays downfield he looked a lot like a bigger, bro-ier Drew Tate.  Either way, he was absolutely spectacular on Saturday and Iowa State needed every drop of that excellence.

* "YOU PLAY TO... go to overtime?"  Kirk Ferentz has either never heard Herm Edwards' most famous quote or thinks it's a load of hogwash because for the second time in three years he took a knee and opted for overtime rather than taking his chances with a potential game-winning drive.  The decision in the '09 Ohio State game has been discussed to death and no doubt this one will be as well.  There may be no empirically right answer to the question; hell, proponents of either side could point to other games involving Big Ten teams on Saturday night as evidence to support their argument.  Indiana got the ball in a tie game with a minute and change to go and attempted to drive for a winning score, only to turn the ball over deep in their own territory and give up a game-winning field goal.  Meanwhile, Michigan and Notre Dame combined for 21 points on three touchdowns in the final 1:12 of the game (although, yes, the situations weren't 100% comparable since at no point were they tied late in the game) as both offenses marched up and down the field.  

That said, there were plenty of compelling reasons to attempt a game-winning drive on Saturday rather than simply sitting back and playing for overtime.  Iowa had two timeouts and 1:17 to go, not to mention a stopped clock at every first down -- that's a virtual eternity in college football. They'd also driven 80 yards just a few minutes earlier in the quarter for the go-ahead touchdown.  They didn't need to go that far at the end of the game, either -- just 50-60 yards would have gotten them within range of a potential game-winning field goal.  A field goal which would have had a great chance of being successful, given Mike Meyer's strong form throughout the game (except on kickoffs).  He'd already booted an impressive 50-yard bomb earlier in the game.  There's also the (not so) slight matter of situational awareness: Iowa State's last four drives of regulation had ended in two touchdowns and two missed field goals and all had involved sustained drives by the ISU offense.  The last punt Iowa had forced was early in the second quarter.  Taking the game to overtime and trusting the defense to make a stop was questionable at best, downright insane at worst.  Finally, at some point you simply need to let your players know that you have faith in them to make plays and win games.  This is the second time now that Ferentz has taken the ball out of Vandenberg's hands rather than give him a chance to lead Iowa on a potential game-winning drive; the fact that he can do that and still issue quote after quote indicating his firm belief in Vandy is one hell of an act of cognitive dissonance. 

* My kingdom for a defense.  Steele Jantz was brilliant yesterday and it would be churlish in the extreme to deny that; he played very well and Iowa State (deservedly) won.  All the same, there's no getting around the fact that his stellar performance was aided and abetted by an Iowa defense that was dreadful.  Two of the best defenses of the last few years have been TCU and Iowa; if TCU had their "the emperor has no clothes" moments last week against Baylor, then this week's debacle in Ames was Iowa's moment of humiliating and revelatory nudity.  It goes beyond the most obvious numbers of disgrace like the score (which was still pretty awful; the 44 points Iowa gave up yesterday were the most they've conceded since the disaster in the desert against Arizona State in 2004) or Jantz's stat line, though.  The secondary (and Greg Castillo in particular) has taken a lot of scorn for their efforts yesterday and not without reason: they too often failed to make simple plays and were never able to make a big, game-changing play (a marked change from 2009-2010, when the Iowa defensive backs feasted on Iowa State quarterbacks).  

Yet we can't discuss their performance without also recognizing that they were left in coverage for huge swaths of time, relatively speaking -- when you give the offense over five seconds on a play (as Iowa did far, far too often yesterday), even the best coverage will begin to break down.  (And, coverage-wise, this is almost certainly the weakest unit Iowa has fielded since 2007.)  To me, the bigger culprit in the defense's failure yesterday was the defensive line.  Too often they couldn't generate any pressure on Jantz and when they did manage to flush him from the pocket, they couldn't catch him, leaving him free to scramble away and find a receiver downfield for yet another back-breaking play.  They weren't great in run support, either: they allowed a 100-yard rusher for the second-straight week (Shontrelle Johnson had 108 yards on 18 carries) and were repeatedly burned on zone-read plays to the outside.  Perhaps the most troubling aspect of the pass rush (or lack thereof) was the fact that Iowa couldn't generate much of a rush even when they tried different things: they blitzed more yesterday than I can recall them doing in any game over the last few years... and it still didn't work (outside of one nice sack from Christian Kirksey, the unquestioned defensive MVP yesterday).  

* No one knows what will happen next.  Still, for all the doom and gloom that fills our corner of Blogfrica right now, it's just one loss.  There are still ten games to go.  Anyone who claims to know how the rest of the season will play out is either an oracle or a filthy liar.  And "oracle" is just a fancy name for a filthy liar.  History certainly isn't much of a guide.  Iowa lost to Iowa State in 2002 and went on to win the conference and play in the Orange Bowl.  Iowa lost to Iowa State in 2007 and went  on to go 6-6 and miss out on a bowl game.  Iowa beat Iowa State in 2009 and went on to narrowly miss out on winning the conference and played in the Orange Bowl.  Iowa beat Iowa State in 2006 and went on to implode down the stretch and limp into a bowl game at 6-6.  And so on.  The result of the Iowa State game is not a reliable indicator of the final outcome an Iowa season.

Granted, the more notable concern is not that Iowa lost to Iowa State, it's how they lost -- with a mobile quarterback shredding their defense.  It doesn't take an oracle to see that that's a recipe for potential disaster down the road, given a schedule that includes notable mobile quarterbacks like Dan Persa, Denard Robinson, and Taylor Martinez.  But there again we run into the problems of accurately predicting the future.  Will Robinson and Martinez still be healthy and effective when Iowa plays them in November?  Will Persa be recovered from his Achilles injury when Iowa plays Northwestern next month?  Will the Iowa defense continue to play as poorly as they did yesterday for the rest of the season?  We can't answer any of these questions.  As college football fans we have an annoying tendency to obsessively try to predict the future (see: the ubiquity of bowl projections -- even before a single game is played!), a feat which we are consistently unable to do with any sort of reliability.  So, please, spare us all the bitter predictions of a 4-5 win season; they don't carry any more predictive value than chipper predictions of a 9-10 win season would have if Iowa had won 35-7.  

Poll
Who was Iowa's man of the match against Iowa State? (NOTE: Iowa players only. Obviously Steele Jantz was the best player of the game for either team.)
Marcus Coker (35 carries, 138 yards, 2 TD; 2 catches, 4 yards)
107 votes
Keenan Davis (5 catches, 95 yards, 1 TD)
125 votes
Christian Kirksey (13 tackles, 2 TFL, 1 sack, 1 FF, 1 FR, 1 pass break-up)
418 votes
Mike Meyer (4/4 FG, long of 50, 3/3 XP)
292 votes
Other (hit up the comments, yo)
12 votes

954 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 515 comments  |  2 recs  | 

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KF and his awe-schucks bullshit is starting to rub me raw.

Play for the effing win already. Kirksey and Prater were the only players worth a damn yesterday.

Battles are won with a hammer, wars are won with a scalpel

by C.I.owA on Sep 11, 2011 9:50 AM CDT reply actions   2 recs

Losses like this remind me that sometimes I just need to step away from the madness after a tough loss.

Nice write up, Ross. You’ve done well to maintain a level head despite an overwhelming flood of assholes yesterday.

by The Mexican't on Sep 11, 2011 9:51 AM CDT reply actions  

Other: No Award

Excuse me for my bellicosity. And spelling. Bellicosity and spelling.

"George Teague doesn't give a shit what down it is. He gets the ball, or he dies." ~ Spencer Hall

by Blackheartnopants on Sep 11, 2011 9:59 AM CDT reply actions  

Excellent write up Ross

I’ll just say that I wish KF would trust his players more. I loved watching Brady Hoke call for a throw for a touchdown with 8 seconds left, even though he had a tying FG almost assuredly in his pocket. We all know we do not have that sort of coach. And I’m not expecting any changes frankly. But as an observer it will be interesting to see how harmful or helpful employing our broadly conservative mentality plays out with this sort of personnel.

Also, I have to say this: I am at a loss for two specific plays we all saw and all hoped we might not ever see again. The reverse and reverse pass. Both of which, predictably, deceived no one.

"I wish you luck with a capital 'F'" - The Real Elvis.

by StoopsMyAss on Sep 11, 2011 10:05 AM CDT reply actions  

Agree, one million percent.

With all of it.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 10:09 AM CDT up reply actions  

I thought for sure KF would trust VDB -- at the very least -- as much as Rhoads trusts Jantz.

To be fair though, no coach trusts his defense more than Kirk Ferentz.

"I wish you luck with a capital 'F'" - The Real Elvis.

by StoopsMyAss on Sep 11, 2011 10:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

One wonders why, though

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 2:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

It is weird, but I think it goes back to the NFL vs College mentality.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

The reverse pass, to me, wasn't that terrible of a play call.

What made it look terrible was that McNutt and Davis weren’t on the same page. McNutt appeared to think that Davis was going to run the corner route under the DB, but Davis had other ideas and expected McNutt to throw it to the back shoulder. Execution was awful, and McNutt should have probably just run the ball instead of committing himself to a pass that wasn’t there.

by The Mexican't on Sep 11, 2011 10:18 AM CDT up reply actions  

YES.

Lots of green in front of him there. Hell, not throwing it probably would’ve worked even better to keep the ISU D honest.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 10:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

Actually, on replay

ISU had two defenders against one Iowa blocker with an angle on McNutt to the edge. Probably would have been a minimal gain. Still would have been the smart play, though.

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 12:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'd have also like to see KF, KOK, and the offense try something at the end of each half.

However, Hoke was in quite a different situation. Hoke was at home, with a huge crowd of his fans watching him, with a team with a really shitty defense (yes, we can make jokes about Iowa’s D, but they are still much better than Michigan’s), with an opponent who has some weapons on offense and probably would score from the 25 most of the time. Michigan had to be in comeback mode for nearly the whole game.

KF was up against ISU, who was due for some big mistakes or failures (that never really came, but I thought they might), on the road, with a defense that now looks like it has big problems but at the time (without in-depth film analysis) still may have looked slightly competent. They were facing an ISU team that had already went a quarter of the game without scoring (and I’m not sure anyone thought they’d reel off 20 points in the overtimes).

And I very much agree that we don’t need to run the end around or the end-around-and-pass anymore. They don’t usually work, and McNutt isn’t much of a thrower at this point. I’d much rather see a Vandy sprint-out pass to McNutt (who may get doubled for the rest of the year).

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 11:29 AM CDT up reply actions  

Play for the win on the road, OT at home.

Isn’t that how the old rule goes? If it makes Hawk fans feel any better (it won’t!), it still seems like it’s easy to score on Michigan, you’ll beat Purdue (that is, if Purdue existed) by 80, and Nebraska (my team) was two big plays from being run over at home by Fresno Goddamned State. Let’s all race to the middle. Go.

"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."-George Bernard Shaw

by Cubehead on Sep 11, 2011 10:07 AM CDT reply actions  

A levelheaded Husker fan?

I like this

"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe

by Brock8144 on Sep 11, 2011 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

Great write-up, Ross.

I voted Kirksey, as he was literally the only person for Iowa playing defense, and he played it well.

Re: Ferentz, game-prep, in-game decisions, etc., I don’t even know what to think anymore, except for that instances like yesterday’s 4th & 1 just make me feel sorry for the players. What a load of shit to have to eat for them.
And I get tired of the endless bitching about KOK; this, and every other uber-conservative tendency is on Ferentz. Period.

No fucking clue what to expect for next week. I could see the Hawks putting an utter beat-down on Pitt a la Sparty last year, or I could see them losing 48-16. Whatever.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 10:08 AM CDT reply actions  

Re: KOK

Obviously the overall gameplan and approach comes from the top down and that falls on KF. But how involved is he in the actual playcalling? Like when we went away from Vandy yesterday after his fairly hot start, was that a direct mandate from KF or was that from KOK?

I don’t know. KOK certainly takes too much abuse, but some of the play calls he makes in the rhythm of the game are downright odd (to put it mildly).

"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"

by RossWB on Sep 11, 2011 10:14 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, very true.

Like I said, I don’t even really know what to think anymore. I really do kinda think even a lot of those odd-rhythm calls are KF. The McNutt pass “trick” (hahahahaha) play, the fucking END AROUND… I think that’s Kirk. I think plays like that are suggested or chosen outright by him in those situations. Otherwise, pretty sure it’s been said by him that all playcalls go through him. KOK chooses them, but he has veto power on everything.
Ugh. I dunno. Whatever. My coffee’s ready.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 10:18 AM CDT up reply actions  

A little of both?

The playcalling in the 2nd quarter, when we were backed up and ISU was stacking the box, was vintage KOK, but it also certainly had the feel of KF’s over-arching influence in that we were so afraid of making a mistake we ignored what was given us and refused to deviate from THE PLAN

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

I wanted to vote for Kirksey,

and he certainly deserves the award.

But I also appreciate a perfect day from a kicker on the road with natural grass, with a long of 50 yards. Therefore, I voted Meyer.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

Same

If Coker hadn’t fumbled, it would’ve been him. I appreciated how well Kirksey seemed to play. But give me a kicker that goes 4 for 4 with a long of 50 yards every time. That’s a Kaeding-esque stat line, and I can only hope that we have that kind of a special teams weapon again.

by stewartom on Sep 11, 2011 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Thinking about it from an "expectations" standpoint

I think the expectation for a good Iowa year is a Legends division title. This loss doesn’t really hurt them in that regard.

I believe that KF will have this team regrouped against Pitt next week.

by CyHawk on Sep 11, 2011 10:11 AM CDT reply actions  

Remember 2003

A Brad Banks team lost at ISU and came back to make us proud. This loss will help shape us the rest of the way. We are in a sense “rebuilding”….

Hate Northwestern, Hate OSU, Michigan State, Michigan too...you get the picture.

by RetroHawk on Sep 11, 2011 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

That was 2002

and it was at Kinnick

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

And Brad Banks ain't on our team this year

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

But Bob Sanders (Bernstine) went down in that game!

The similarities are startling! Just kidding Bernstine isn’t Sanders. But it won’t hurt to have him back.

by Argulor on Sep 11, 2011 5:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

I've said it for years now.

Kirk Ferentz.
Great player developer.
Miserable game manager.

I will haunt your dreams and eat your children.

by Dr. Hawk on Sep 11, 2011 10:12 AM CDT reply actions  

Your reward is in the mail.

Good luck in your future NFL coaching career.

by The Mexican't on Sep 11, 2011 10:21 AM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Oh - and yesterday Kyle noted that KF is basically a football version of Eddard Stark (sorry, non-Game of Thrones nerds*).

So completely steadfast and unyielding in his adherence to The Code (whatever the hell that may be) that he’s totally blind to to any other possibility for how the same goals might be achieved. And eventually… well, no spoilers.
 
 
*not really sorry, at all


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 10:13 AM CDT reply actions  

Luckily for Ferentz, Barta is no Cersei Lannister.

"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"

by RossWB on Sep 11, 2011 10:14 AM CDT up reply actions  

No.

Cersei is the fanbase.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions  

So that makes Bret Bielema...

Roose Bolton? Actually that works pretty well from your perspective.

by battlekow on Sep 11, 2011 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

Actually

My hope is that Bielema ends up like Theon Turncloak.

by cruzhawk on Sep 11, 2011 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'll go a little further....

Ferentz is a skinny Samwell Tarley. Really smart with lots of potential but too craven to apply it. And every now and again he has to slay an Other because he has no choice so people think he isn’t as craven as he truly is.

by cruzhawk on Sep 11, 2011 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

I feel worse about things today...

Excuse me for my bellicosity. And spelling. Bellicosity and spelling.

"George Teague doesn't give a shit what down it is. He gets the ball, or he dies." ~ Spencer Hall

by Blackheartnopants on Sep 11, 2011 10:22 AM CDT reply actions  

I don't.

At least about the football. Iowa, for better or worse, generally gets better during the year. Sometimes quite a bit better. I’m not going to burn my Hawk duds until at least mid-October. The flood of douchbag posters from yesterday, on the other hand. Hopefully Iowa wins Saturday and they go back to living under their rock.

by Norm Parker's Amputated Toes on Sep 11, 2011 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, losses like that always flip over those rocks. It is what it is.

Also, KILL CASTILLO AND AJ DERBY MUST PLAY NOW ALWAYS AND IGNORE THE D LINE IT’S FINE BUT MAN THAT CASTILLO GUY IS POOPY AND VDB CANT THROW AND BLLEEEEEAAAARRRRRGGGHHH.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

Earth to Castillo

What planet was he on yesterday?? He certainly got great separation…..too bad he plays defense.

Hate Northwestern, Hate OSU, Michigan State, Michigan too...you get the picture.

by RetroHawk on Sep 11, 2011 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't feel as bad about the loss today as yesterday

Perspective and distance always helps. But I am wary of this notion that Iowa “generally gets better during the year”. There was an article on BHGP last year by PV (I believe) examining that meme and pretty much noted that, outside of 2008, that generally hasn’t been the case for going on 6 yeas now. We hope Iowa improves over the course of the season, but the evidence for that lately has been lacking.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm going more by "eyeball" than by W-L.

They might lose, but if they don’t look like a bunch of individualistic grabassing fucktards doing it, I count that as improvement even it’s an L. Sometimes they get tOSU and their QB gets hurt at the end of the season. Sometimes you get a couple good bounces and hang half a hundred on Minny. Last year, obviously, they didn’t improve.

by Norm Parker's Amputated Toes on Sep 11, 2011 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ugh. I really wish I didn't agree with all of this.

But it makes as much sense as anything else.
My coffee needs bourbon.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions  

I have bourbon and three hours before work!

See you in 30!

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 11:29 AM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed w/ everything....except,

I’m not quite sure why everyone is obsessed with the whole ‘spy’ thing. I think this might be a product of folks playing Madden or NCAA too much. When have you ever heard of a successful, defensive coach use this concept as a part of their strategy?

WIth that said I think the D-Line and LB’s spent way too much time ‘spying’ and not enough time ‘sniping’ yesterday….

"Are you sayin' Jesus Christ can't hit a curveball?"

by DCHawkeye07 on Sep 11, 2011 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

I have never played a video game of any sort,

but the ‘spy’ thing is a Frank Beamer thing, and they’re probably the best D-I defense over the past 20 years. The idea is to have an unblocked man knocking down a mobile QB. There were five or six people blocking our four D-linemen all afternoon. Football is numbers.

We play tackle football.

by Bellanca on Sep 11, 2011 11:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

Like maybe Morris?

Then what happens with the middle of field? Or, maybe Hyde? They struggle enough without having to have somebody’s eyes in the backfield.

I don’t play VG’s either, but with my limited experience with NCAA 2004 (Braylon was unstoppable), there was always ‘spy’ sets….

Do you just have your ‘spy’ run after him on every play? Or just watch him (that happened enough yesterday)

Frank Beamer does do a nice job on D though…. But, from a numbers standpoint, so do the Hawks…

"Are you sayin' Jesus Christ can't hit a curveball?"

by DCHawkeye07 on Sep 11, 2011 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

It's how we shut down Denard. Our WILL or a strong-safety type.

My suspicion is that Kirksey had a lot of spy responsibility but it’s impossible to know what’s going on watching a telecast.

We play tackle football.

by Bellanca on Sep 11, 2011 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

Kirksey, or maybe even Binns

If your goal is quarterback contain and you so obviously have no chance of generating a pass rush with the front four, why not drop a defensive end into a containment/spy role?

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

While this doesn't surprise me

I always did think of you as a Myst fanatic.

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 11, 2011 4:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

This is all correct, and the last paragraph is the most correct (and most baffling) part of it.

If the Franimal had the final possession with a chance to win, gave the ball to his point guard, and had him dribble at the top of the key until the clock expired without even taking a shot, we’d fire him before overtime started.

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

This would never happen.

When it became apparent what was happening, Marge would run out of the stands, grab the ball and drive the lane.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Only in Iowa...

…could a coach admit that he only really does 3/4 of his job and get applause for it. Lots of coaches out there can prepare in AND out of conference…

by Nyghtewynd on Sep 11, 2011 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

I wouldn't say Ferentz failed to prepare his players for this game.

You can’t prepare a defensive line to get pressure when it’s not capable of doing so. Sure, some of the playcalling can be called into question but there is no evidence to suggest that this team was not adequately prepared. Sometimes you lose, more often than not it’s due to being outplayed. We lost yesterday because we were outplayed.

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." - Teddy Roosevelt

by HawKCP on Sep 11, 2011 10:49 AM CDT reply actions  

I thought that the D-line got a lot of pressure on them.

They just didn’t knock that QB down. But they were faster, tougher, and more resilient than I expected to see. I also think that we learned they cannot be stopped by “big guys”, just refs who let the big guys tackle. Jantz, had he been ear-holed a couple of times while he was running in circles wouldn’t have had a PERFECT pass efficiency score.

What’s missing is respect for what a Jantz can do by extending plays. There is a clock with Iowa’s defense, and they tend to turn into pumpkins after four seconds, as does any pass-defending D. I think this is where the new, smaller SAMs come in, and why we blitzed more.

As a footnote, I thought it was interesting that, three years after the bowl game with King and Kroul making him miserable, Spurrier is running a D-line like ours. Their best lineman is an ex-running back. He was all over the place.

We play tackle football.

by Bellanca on Sep 11, 2011 10:59 AM CDT up reply actions  

That is so very true.

It does seem that our defenses have been getting less and less nasty every year. Not that you want to go out and injure guys but we used to hang our hats on defense on our ability to knock quarterbacks out of the game.

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." - Teddy Roosevelt

by HawKCP on Sep 11, 2011 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions  

That's part of it. No question our defense got run off the field.

But I really think we could have taken control on offense and scored enough to play keep-away.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 10:59 AM CDT up reply actions  

If we were playing to win (following Bellanca's reasoning here)

then we would have stepped on the gas in Q2. Instead, we did not stretch the defense, we contracted it. Coker ran the ball 12 times or so and caught two swing passes in two series of downs.

At that point the ISU defense did what most OC’s dream of — assuming they have a decent QB — ISU put 9 guys in the box and said, “enough of that dude, if we lose we lose by McNutt.” We, in response, kept running. Went three and out and punted.

Then the field position advantage shifted but by that time Coker had touched the ball an astonishing 16 times in less than 1/3 of a game, and on the next series, because we were deep in our own territory, we…ran some more and SUPRISE our sophomore running back fumbled.

From that moment forward, we were a different team and it was a completely different game.

"I wish you luck with a capital 'F'" - The Real Elvis.

by StoopsMyAss on Sep 11, 2011 11:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yes.

As soon as KMM caught that touchdown pass, it sure seemed like over the teevee that all the air got sucked out of the stadium-ish place and you could almost feel the collective “ah shit, here we go again, oh well at least it’s a nice day mmmmm Natty Light back in the van” thoughts of the I-State faithful.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed as well

I really felt good after we went up 10-0. Crap, I was almost past this loss.

"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe

by Brock8144 on Sep 11, 2011 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions  

True.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions  

Scratch where it itches.

Or don’t – and lose.

"I hope we're not looking past Alabama to Temple the next Saturday." - Jack Ham

by ReadingRambler on Sep 11, 2011 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Right.

Clearly, we weren’t playing to win, we were (again, following Bellanca’s reasoning) playing to play – to develop players.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

Which I absolutely agree with.

The downside to KF’s NFL chops is that there’s a playoff at the end of the year in his head: he just wants his team ready for Foxboro in January.

Honestly, look back to most of Iowa’s blowout wins over the last few years. Michigan State comes to mind. That blowout wasn’t so much the result of merciless offensive play-calling, it came largely as the result of Iowa’s D turning mistakes into points. That has been their MO for a while now. The offense, on the other hand, is not capable (or willing) to take the pressure off of the D in order to get wins. Yes, the defense needs to play better, but the inability and unwillingness to step on the neck of the opposition early (because it’s disrespectful? Cue Eddard Stark comparisons for KF) has been the undoing of this team many times.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions  

In a year like this,

where nobody expects us to win them all, I’m OK with getting ready for the Big Ten.

We should have beat ISU, and I’m not happy that we failed to do so, but if that somehow makes us go 6-2 in conference instead of 3-5, it will probably be worth it.

Now, if we don’t get the defense improving, and if we get Coker hurt at 30 carries a game, then we may not even get to 3-5 in conference, but let’s not think about that yet.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

Impossible to know...

If this is the loss to spur us to go 6-2, or not.
But I maintain that for this year, best case scenario is playing on black friday for a chance to play Wisc (my guess). In the grand scheme of things, I hope this loss gets us closer to this.

Please don't tell me how you hate BSU or their turf...I know all too well and keep my toliet water blue for a reason.

by BoiseHawk on Sep 11, 2011 4:49 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

That would be nice.

Our D must improve. Our offensive play-calling must improve. Our pass-catching must improve. Hell, even our blocking probably needs to improve.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

Good thing

We don’t start division play until Oct 15th

Please don't tell me how you hate BSU or their turf...I know all too well and keep my toliet water blue for a reason.

by BoiseHawk on Sep 11, 2011 7:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

My fear

is that it won’t somehow make us go 6-2. KF, hopefully found some things that don’t work and can be improved on. But every other team we play found out that Northwestern’s plan works to beat us, even if used by a team that’s not Northwestern. He’s not just playing an exhibition training us, he’s playing an exhibition that’s showing what we can do to our future opponents.

"'Contrariwise,' continued Tweedledee, 'If it was so, it might be; and if it were so, it would be; as it isn't, it ain't. That's logic." - Lewis Caroll, Alice Through the Looking Glass

by chitownhawkeye on Sep 11, 2011 5:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

"The downside to KF’s NFL chops is that there’s a playoff at the end of the year in his head: he just wants his team ready for Foxboro in January."

THIS.

THIS.

ONE BAZILLION TIMES THIS.

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm thising your THIS because I also agree with this.

So… this.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, you play to your team's strengths.

It’s clear this won’t be a vintage D, but there are bright spots on this team. Our primary option at RB seems to suddenly be a headcase and his O-line doesn’t seem to get much push. However, that same back seems capable of gashing the D on obvious “passing downs” and the O-line has been pretty stalwart in pass-protection through two games.

Our tight ends still have a looooong way to go in order to live up to Iowa’s standards at that position (Brad Herman, what happened to your hands?). However, Keenan Davis (who I voted for), despite a crushing drop late in the game, emerged as a viable 2nd option for Vandenberg yesterday. The coaching staff is going to have to swallow their pride and reach back to 2004 in order to find success; Iowa will need to pass to set up the run and, like it or not, have to out-score most teams in order to win.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

Unless and until Coker is in a cast

this will not be 2004. And maybe not even then. I think we need to get on board to that.

"I wish you luck with a capital 'F'" - The Real Elvis.

by StoopsMyAss on Sep 11, 2011 11:43 AM CDT up reply actions  

But this is where coaching is so crucial. You need to put your players in a position to succeed.

Clearly he’s got major jitters. So what do we do? Force him to run strait into the teeth of a defense when all he can think about is holding onto the ball, not finding seems or following blockers. We all seemed to have anointed him a veteran after running through a sieve of a run defense in last year’s Insight Bowl but the fact remains that he’s still learning the game at this level.

What would have been great for his confidence is to give him carries after the game is out of reach (and off his shoulders), which appeared to be where this was headed if the passing offense kept clicking, which may have continued if we wouldn’t have fucked with its rhythm.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

Here's the problem...

they were giving him carries when they thought the game was out of reach… the 2nd quarter. It was the same old bullshit we’ve seen too many times. “We have a lead and our offense seems comfortable… let’s just kill 35:00 off the clock and leave.”

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 11, 2011 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don't know that they thought that it was"out of reach" per se

but I do think it was going according to plan. It’s the plan (and we both agree here) that needs to change.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

In Coker's defense

By the 4th qtr and OT, he looked like he had the confidence back and was running with purpose again, rather than just to protect the ball. here’s hoping it carries over until next week.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

Thoughts on the game...

The game was managed poorly yesterday and that falls on Ferentz. Shut up and go for the win with 1:17 and 2to’s. He should be embarrassed.

Coker struggles continue. Something like 3 fumbles in 26 carries? Also he wasn’t hitting the hole very hard and struggle with vision, too. And by the way KOK, Coker is not a screen pass back.

McNutt was mostly a non-factor. Was that because his number wasn’t called enough or that JVB wasn’t finding him?

Castillo needs to go. He was defending a WR in the endzone and he went for the tackle instead of making a play on the ball? Rly?

Hyde looked lost at times and I don’t think Prater was very active on defense. Morris played out of place often. No one tackled. I mean no one…it was bad last week, exponentially worse this week.

How is kickoff coverage a problem in two consecutive years??

That is all.

by bornofclay on Sep 11, 2011 11:02 AM CDT via mobile reply actions  

So Iowa can churn out NFL players.

Good for the NFL! How about employing that talent to win close games and conference titles while they’re STILL AT IOWA? I have delayed anger. Pardon the caps.

"I mean, are they going to poop their pants or are they going to get tough?" ~Tom Brands

by Hawkeyegirl on Sep 11, 2011 11:18 AM CDT reply actions  

It's not unrelated, I suspect.

Iowa, which does win, btw, (2nd in Big Ten wins last decade, tied with Michigan) has to go through games like this to develop unheralded athletes. As in, we have 8 guys starting whom no one else wanted (four walk-ons, four scholarship guys who received only one offer); we have 10 walk-ons in the top 44. This is unheard of.

That’s why I think of this game as a kind of scrimmage, as will be the game next week. Ferentz wants to be a developmental coach, because otherwise, he’s a coach with a losing record.

We play tackle football.

by Bellanca on Sep 11, 2011 11:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

And he's probably correct to want to be.

When other programs (Ohio St, Auburn, Oregon, etc) are allowed to buy players and keep them “happy” with hookers and blow (Miami FL), it is difficult to beat them in recruiting battles. So, you bring in super-hard-workers who you may make into NFL players.

As an Iowa fan, I’m fine with that. I’d honestly rather watch Mitch King in black and gold than Warren Sapp.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

Who says the guy believes in moral victories?

Every time we lose a game people want to start attributing any bad characteristic they can think of to Ferentz.

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." - Teddy Roosevelt

by HawKCP on Sep 11, 2011 12:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

I say that.

And why do you think believing moral victories are a bad characteristic?

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 12:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

I might occasionally believe in moral victories

when it is against a heavily-favored team like OSU, or Michigan back when they were still good, or USC at the beginning of their fraud-empire.

I don’t really see much of a moral victory against an “inferior” opponent. To me, not winning against them is something a bit like choking.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

Moral victories have nothing to do with the state of the opponent

and everything to do with the state of your own program. The finish of the ‘00 season could be considered a moral victory. The Insight Bowl last year cannot be. While we can’t expect Iowa to win every game based on the factors in play, I think we’re past the point of just being happy to participate, even against the “big boys”.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 12:46 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

And that's fine.

I’m not sure KF sees any moral victory yesterday (I don’t). But we also probably didn’t flush a crystal football down the toilet yesterday, so why get angry at fellow Hawk fans (or coaches) about it?

Blame Rhoads and Jantz, (and I’m sure they are glad to take the blame for yesterday).

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

Except this time the coach's shortcomings so apparently made it impossible to win

Anyone with have a brain and a bit of guts would look at the progression of that game, where Iowa couldn’t stop ISU’s offense on four consecutive series, and especially in the last series where they had ISU in 3rd and 16 and 3rd and 20 and let them escape, and realize that the best chance of winning was taking advantage of having a final possession. Ferentz, instead, sat on the ball like an egg.

Anyone with brains and guts would have realized that, in the third overtime, there was basically no chance of us stopping Iowa State’s offense (again) and taken that beautiful five-yard penalty as a sign from the gods that the 4th and 1 should be converted (especially because the running game was working). In fact, at that point, anyone with an ounce of long-term planning should have realized that we were not going to win in an offense-first overtime period, where ISU knew what it had to get, and needed to score touchdowns and wait our turn. Ferentz kicked the field goal anyway, which virtually guaranteed a loss, and Rhoads made that happen.

In earlier losses, there have always been questionable calls, and some people (me included) gripe over the decisions that were made. Yesterday’s decisions were not of that variety. These were obvious mistakes, made by a man who is either an idiot or a coward. He wasn’t that way before. He’s somehow become it now.

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions   2 recs

There you go again!?!

Honestly, I couldn’t really argue with your comment until you said “KF is either an idiot or a coward.”

Maybe he actually thought his defense might man up and come through (and we may have been able to, we had some guys in the area where the final TD run went in).

And do you call every other coach a coward when they repeatedly make conservative calls? Because there are plenty of guys lining up for that honor.

It is as if everyone expected KF to turn into Sean Payton or Chris Peterson over the last two years. Well, I’d prefer we not raid the pill locker, because our RBs are probably going to need those pain-killers at some point.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Rec'd partly for the perfect analogy

and partly because, well, we’ve got this on record now.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

The post is coming.

Hold onto your trousers.

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree that it was uber-conservative.

But I would not call it cowardly. There are plenty of “football experts” out there who make money being “football experts” that understand that the last minute of a road game against a team with growing confidence is a situation that has turnover written all over it.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

And? How often do they score after that TO.

A turnover by itself is irrelevant, and you really stop mentioning it.

Until you show me that the percentage favors the defensive team scoring over the offensive team when the offensive team has the ball with 77 seconds left, I’m just going to continue to say you’re making stuff up.

And you can’t say it’s true because “so many coaches do it” because a) that’s vague at best and b) there are a bunch of coaches that play for the win. Nebraska went for it yesterday with :25 seconds left in the half, and they threw an interception. But Fresno State didn’t score.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sorry, if our

defense tackled that poorly yesterday, I’m not optimisitic that our offense will stop them from turning TOs into TDs.

Also, our previous QB had a knack for pick-sixes. Maybe it was all Ricky’s fault, or maybe it is a sign that we don’t want picks in the flat, particularly late in a game.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

Please clarify?

Also, we lost plenty of games late last year.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

Because we often sucked at holding a lead

no?

The University of Iowa: the best 6 years of my life. My parents are very proud.

by HawkeyeGirleye on Sep 11, 2011 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Right.

Because once you get a lead, and another team is forced to go for the win, it is still just the D’s fault?

I tend to blame last year’s losses on a mix of late-game offensive ineptitude, late game defensive fatigue/ineptitude, and usually some special teams breakdowns mixed in.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, once you get a lead

the offense has ‘done’ their job. The defenses job is to keep the other guys from scoring. So, yeah, I blame the D over the O in those situations.

If you lose a game 10-7, then I blame the O more- the D did a good job at their ‘job’ but the O didn’t. Lose a game 44-41, then, yeah, I think the D is to blame. Giving up 41 points is awful; scoring 44 is outstanding.

The University of Iowa: the best 6 years of my life. My parents are very proud.

by HawkeyeGirleye on Sep 11, 2011 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

So, every time Iowa kicks a FG,

the D has to pitch a shutout.

Got it.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

If it's OT

they best do no worse than a FG.

If the O can do no better than FG on any given possession, aren’t you hoping the D will turn around at get the ball back for you & not let them score? I am. I know they won’t always hold them just like I know the O won’t always score. Doesn’t change the fact that each has a job to do & sometimes one does it’s job better than the other. Sometimes you can overcome that, sometimes you can’t. Yesterday, we couldn’t.

The University of Iowa: the best 6 years of my life. My parents are very proud.

by HawkeyeGirleye on Sep 11, 2011 3:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

And delusion shouldn't be confused with strategy

“Maybe he actually thought his defense might man up and come through (and we may have been able to, we had some guys in the area where the final TD run went in).”

If he honestly thought his defense had any chance of stopping Iowa State in a four-down situation, he’s crazier than we thought. They hadn’t stopped ISU in over a half, despite doing a decent job of putting them deep and making them drive. That ship had sailed, and if he was making decisions based on abilities that his defense quite clearly didn’t have, well, I don’t even know what to say.

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

Jantz threw three picks the week before.

He had a nice game against Iowa, but he isn’t “faster-version-of-young-Dan-Marino.”

I don’t think it is absurd to expect your defense (with 5 returning starters) to hold Jantz, a decent OL, and a bunch of rejects to an FG in a pressure situation. But, it didn’t happen.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

I guess that's fine

but it’s against the weight of 60 minutes of evidence, and that makes it less an informed decision and more a matter of blind faith. And, at this point, I’m not putting blind faith in this defense, and I’m pretty sure you wouldn’t either.

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Is it blind faith if it is backed by probability?

Even at halftime yesterday, would you have expected Iowa to give up the game-winning 4-yard TD to a RB?

I would not have.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Nice red herring

Lose the game on 4-yard TD run? Probably wouldn’t expect it. But I would expect Iowa to lose at halftime yesterday given the way we let ISU back in the game in the 2nd and came out flat in the 3rd.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

He threw three INTs the week before

but NONE up to that point. And hadn’t EVEN BEEN CLOSE to doing so.

Chazz, you’re just being head-in-the-sand stubborn. Anyone with half a brain watching that game yesterday knew what the momentum of the game was. Yet you cling to this notion that 101 ifs and buts and different things had happened, everything would have worked out fine. That’s true. But they didn’t. And the more ridiculous point is expecting them to occur.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

Right, because it is much better to

just make decisions on how you feel the game is going at that point, rather than consider more than a quarter or two of a game for information.

Again, I don’t think I sit on the ball at the end of that game. But people act like there is no information that could lead to that decision. And I don’t agree.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

No Chazz

New information is more valuable than old. And the new information available yesterday was that Jantz wasn’t going to turn into an INT machine. Why? Because he wasn’t being pressured into rushing things: too often he had all the time in the world, and when he didn’t, he was able to use his feet to escape. things build upon themselves, by the 4th qtr, it was abundantly clear that (1) Jantz wasn’t going to cause ISU to lose (he might not win it, but he wouldn’t lose it) and (2) our defense couldn’t stop them. Clinging to this notion that just because he was bad last week, he would probably be so again doesn’t work once their is evidence refuting it.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

So everyone that plays 3 or 4 good quarters

will not lose the game with a turnover.

Can’t buy it.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

Fucking-a Chazz

and maybe unicorns will fall from the sky. Could a turnover happen? Absolutely, but it wasn’t as likely as Jantz continuing to do what he had done.

You’re obsessed with pie-in-the-sky possibilities that didn’t happen and, what’s more, weren’t likely to happen. Then you turn around and act as if everyone has to disprove that this (a turnover) could NOT have happened. Whatever, you’re just stubborn.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 4:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes. And I'm the only one.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think I'm with you

For what it is worth (little value)

Please don't tell me how you hate BSU or their turf...I know all too well and keep my toliet water blue for a reason.

by BoiseHawk on Sep 11, 2011 4:56 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

I appreciate it.

I do feel criticized from all corners once in awhile around here.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

Dude.

Ronald Reagan was less conservative and stubborn than Ferentz. For my point, I cite the fact that Reagan was once a Democrat.

"I hope we're not looking past Alabama to Temple the next Saturday." - Jack Ham

by ReadingRambler on Sep 11, 2011 1:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

In todays political environment, absolutely.

Raising taxes, public declaring a want of fewer nuclear weapons in the world? The gall!

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

I hate the fact that this is so reasonable I have to pretty much agree.

"I hope we're not looking past Alabama to Temple the next Saturday." - Jack Ham

by ReadingRambler on Sep 11, 2011 1:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

I enjoyed your Twitter rants last night

Just thought of one.

Kirk Ferentz just folded pocket Aces before the flop.

by cruzhawk on Sep 11, 2011 3:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not sure I do.

But I also don’t think dropping the occasional game to ISU is a panic-inducing situation.

Now, if we go another couple years against jNW without a win, I may panic like a crack addict under a police squad car spotlight.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 12:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

You just said you'd rather have hard-working players that won't win as much....

…than have better players that may possibly have bad “morals”.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 12:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

I do want Iowa players to be good representatives of the school/state/etc.

I don’t want my favorite team to become a bunch of mercenaries with cocaine addictions (like Miami FL).

To me, it would be great if Iowa could win a national title. But if we have to hire Nick Saban, or bring in guys like Warren Sapp or Reggie Bush or Terrell Pryor, then I’m fine with competing for the conference title and going to the Fiesta Bowl (when the national title game is in New Orleans).

And since Iowa hasn’t won any football national title that other people recognize (yes, I know, that one back in the Evy days that nobody outside Iowa knows about), I don’t exactly get pissed that we aren’t doing it now.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

yes, those are moral victories.

That’s fine to have that mindset, but why do you deny it?

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

Like I said, I tend to think of moral victories as performance against a

favored opponent.

Iowa only faces a favored opponent about 3 or so times a year anymore.

But, I understand that you have to find something to label others with, or complain about, so I guess I’m your huckleberry. And Ferentz is a coward. And so on and so forth.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

So,

you don’t believe in moral victories, except when you do. And Iowa should play to win, but it doesn’t matter if they don’t do so in certain games; those games being a nebulous definition of “big” games.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

I realize you guys are trying to make me angry.

But I’ll just explain this one more time:

To me, if you lose to an “inferior” opponent, no moral victory can be found, unless you literally saved three babies from a death fall from the upper deck.

Moral victories (and I don’t often feel this way) might possibly be found when you play a more-highly-rated opponent very close and still lose, kind of like OSU at the shoe in 2009. Again, I’d prefer to win, but I’m not going to get depressed and bitch at other fans online because it happened.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

Actually Chazz

I wasn’t trying to make you angry at all. If anything, your posts have helped clarify what I believe your attitude/philosophy to be and allowed me to have a better understanding of why you seemingly can find no fault in KF ever. Or, to be more accurate, how you can consistently credit KF for everything that goes right, but pawn off responsibility for that which doesn’t on someone else.

I fundamentally disagree, but at least I think I now understand it.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

Again, responsibility and criticism are fine for KF.

Guy makes enough money. He is the leader of all things on-field and many off.

But, I’d just expect Hawk fans to be able to fathom why he’d make that call. Not agree with it. Not enjoy watching it. But just realize that it wasn’t completely cowardly and he isn’t an idiot.

At this point, I’ve seen enough pot-shots and “nuanced posts” about KF to think that some people around here are just bored and tired of him, and they won’t ever be happy with him again unless he brings home a crystal football. And then, we’ll get two weeks of BHGP posts about how that championship season could have been even sweeter.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:00 PM CDT up reply actions   2 recs

I understand why he made the call

or, at least, I think I do. I also know why successive US presidents got is progressively more involved in Vietnam. Doesn’t mean they, and Ferentz, weren’t wrong in doing so. And that’s what’s at issue here. Ferentz made the wrong call, multiple times, yesterday. And it cost us. And until he confronts this, we’re doomed to repeat it.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 4:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well Stated

Hawkeye football is still Hawkeye football. That’s what makes it so great…….next man in. As poor as we played yesterday all we needed was for one guy to step up and make a play in either the 4th quarter or OT. Let’s get ready for Pitt….we owe them for the loss at Heinz Field (decorated to be a college venue) a couple of years ago.

Hate Northwestern, Hate OSU, Michigan State, Michigan too...you get the picture.

by RetroHawk on Sep 11, 2011 2:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

Note: I didn't say Iowa doesn't win games.

I said close games. Carry on.

"I mean, are they going to poop their pants or are they going to get tough?" ~Tom Brands

by Hawkeyegirl on Sep 11, 2011 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

I love Bellanca's Coker-therapy analogy.

Partly because I think he’s correct. Was there ANY earthly reason White or Johnson did not have a single carry yesterday? Or catch a single pass? What the hell was that about? How long do they think Coker—a guy who wore a no-contact jersey all camp—will last getting smooshed 40 times a game?

I think the Hyde safety experiment is at an end. That’s all I have to say about that.

What the heck is up with the TE’s? Please, someone tell me since I haven’t a clue.

This question is so obvious, I’m almost embarrassed to ask it for fear that the answer will expose my football X and O ignorance: okay, when we blitz, why do we do it on the side the QB is rolling-out AWAY from? It’s the blind side, but the QB has a five yard headstart and you’ll never catch him that way. This happened repeatedly yesterday.

Don’t get me going on KF’s strageies. All I’ll say is this: when your D is gassed and playing for shit, you want to end the game one way or another AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. That might mean trying to win in regulation. That might mean going for 2 in OT. That might mean going on 4th and 1 to try and get a TD.

KF took none of those options, To me, this is another JC over Stanzi Pitt game moment: it has changed in some way how I view the competency of this coach as a game manager.

That is all.

"Apparently, riding Joe Paterno like a small horse is FROWNED UPON IN THIS ESTABLISHMENT!"

by The Director on Sep 11, 2011 11:27 AM CDT reply actions   1 recs

Once Rhoads decided that Jantz was going to be his Persa

the game was a shoot out. At least I thought it was. I did not have much faith that we knew how to stop them. I also felt like we were uncertain we could play in a shootout but were willing to try. That is why the kneel down with 1:17 was so stunning. And fucking stupid and not the right message to send to your team. It was, as you said, a message that we are fighting a war and this battle is only a small part of that war.

"I wish you luck with a capital 'F'" - The Real Elvis.

by StoopsMyAss on Sep 11, 2011 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

Bad luck probably.

It’s not like he suddenly changed to a southpaw on us and ran in a completely unexpected direction yesterday.

by Norm Parker's Amputated Toes on Sep 11, 2011 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

Coker getting fed the ball that many times

supports the theory (to me) that KF saw this game as somewhat of a live exhibition. If the goal was to test him, I think he passed pretty convincingly, save for the fumble (which I’m still mostly chalking up to a great tackle).

Brad Herman needs to sit. He’s been piss-poor awful catching the ball and in routes both of the first two games. His blocking will keep him around, but he needs to wake up.

The big problem with the defense that I have kept going back to since the jNW loss last year is why, oh why we keep four downed linemen in the game on downs like 3rd and 15 or 3rd and 20 late in the game (especially when we aren’t getting pressure anyway). It’s yet another example of continually relying on a system that doesn’t always work, and refusing to adapt out of steadfastness when every thing points to the need to change.

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 11, 2011 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions  

And a lot of times that lack of pressure up front seems almost planned.

Like the front four are commanded to get a 1-2 yard push, and then sorta hold and play contain as opposed to just berserker-style bullrushing (while maintaining lane discipline,of course). There were a few times yesterday where Binns or Daniels or whoever would get a decent push… and then just stop and stand there.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

I saw what you were talking about yesterday

but for every time the D-line seemed to be spinning their wheels, there were just as many times that ISU’s O-line was simply manhandling our guys. They were good.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yep.

And also just as many times where the DL did break through and hurry him, force him out of the pocket, only to tackle nothing and lose contain (which sorta reinforces my thought that after Denard & Persa last year, they’re told to stay home and contain).


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 11:57 AM CDT up reply actions  

KF has a painfully long memory. I still believe it's the '09 NU game

that makes him so hesitant to “run up the score”. Much like this game, when Iowa got up 10-0 in that one with relative ease, everyone started having flashbacks of our mauling of the Cats back in ’02. Then Stanzi threw the pick that eventually led to Iowa being pinned back in their redzone and then, well, we know the rest.

I can’t help but think that, after that, KF started thinking to himself, “see, that’s why you need to rein it in.” It’s totally illogical, but I truly believe it’s moments like such as that which inform his decision making.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 12:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

I have to disagree here.

We’ve rolled it up a bit against Minnesota and even a couple times against ISU.

No, we don’t do so like Hayden.

But I really don’t think KF is saying “don’t score more than 21 in a half, because people will think I’m mean.”

I think it is more likely to be Bellanca’s idea that, once we get up 10, we try some skill-building. Or maybe it is a bit like my assertion (I’m sure others have said it, but I know I wrote it here yesterday or today) that KOK and Erb just get too conservative with the play-calling.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 12:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

I didn't say he's hesitant to run up the score because he thinks it isn't nice.

I think he’s hesitant because, unless the opposing side is letting you run for 10 ypc, the way you’ll typically put up a lot of points is by airing the ball out. I think he’s afraid to.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think statistics

would support the idea that running is safer (in terms of avoiding turnovers) than going into 2004 Drew Tate mode, right?

So it isn’t “being afraid”, it’s going with probability.

And, at that point in the game (before OT), ISU’s offense isn’t exactly considered awesome. So, why help them out by chucking it all over and possibly giving them a pick? (I know we’ve fumbled plenty, too).

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

You answered your own question.

There are generalized statistics and then there are those that pertain to the team in question. Through just 5 quarters of play, it had become apparent that the far more dangerous/less-productive option was to run the ball with the personnel available. Decisions aren’t made in a vacuum, they’re made in real-time with the evidence available at that moment. Tell me again why it would have been a bad idea to keep passing?

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well,

McNutt or Davis or Herman could start dropping balls, or volleyball-setting them to the Clones. Vandy could get sacked/hurt on a day when our OL isn’t exactly burying the fools in red and gold.

Meanwhile, at the end of quarter 1, maybe Coker’s fumble problems are chalked up more to rain than to his brain.

Running is safer. It has been that way for most levels of football for a long time. Maybe Stoops is right and it isn’t that way anymore. But I’d prefer we not find out that Stoops is wrong with three Vandy picks in a half against ISU.

And finally, our players have been practicing for a certain philosophy. Maybe we need to change the philosophy, but it is tough to do so in the middle of a road game.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

They could have

but we fucking KNEW that the running wasn’t working. We aren’t dealing in a theoretical on that one. At some point Chazz, you have to deal with the reality you face, rather than the one you expected.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

The running wasn't working, except for our last TD in

the 4th quarter?

Maybe you need to deal with some reality.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

Huh?

I was talking about earlier in the game when we had a chance to end it and decided not to. I don’t really blame Coker for the fumble yesterday, I don’t think he should have been put in that situation. And I blame KOK and KF for putting him in it.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

My bad for not interpreting you properly.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

Why is not turning the ball over the only good thing to consider?

(warning: going to make up numbers for illustrative purposes)

If throwing the ball triples your chance of scoring,or say, increases your scoring per drive by 5 pts.

and running the ball only reduces the chances of the other team scoring (because they don’t score on every turnover, say)by a 1/3 or by 2 pts, doesn’t the probability favor throwing?

If you have or know of a study that has shown what you say to be true, I’d love to see it.

And as McCan’t said, with Coker’s fumble worries and teh obvious advantage of Iowa’s WRs over ISUs CBs, it definitely seemed that the higher score diffferential would result from throwing. And that of course, is the point. You can’t just consider one side of it in that the other team doesn’t score (especially when you’re considering that they couldn’t stop ISU in the entire 2nd half), but you also have to think about you scoring more.

This game should have been a shootout due to the Iowa’s good throwing offense for the most part and their bad defense. But Ferentz does not seem to ever want to favor a shootout over a ground-it-game. And that’s why people call him “scared”.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Running the ball means you keep it away from the other team.

And, that’s usually a good thing, because many teams have trouble putting up points without the ball.

Do you think Brian Kelly, or Gary Patterson, or Mark Richt, or Gary Pinkel, or Dan Mullen are happy they got into shootouts in the last two weeks? (All of those except Richt were on the road against BCS/AQ competition).

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

no, but i'm sure Brady Hoke, Bo Pelini, Arizona St, Auburn, south Carolina....

….Wake Forest, La Tech are.

See how dumb it is to pick out single cases to make a point? I just won because I have more.And mine are just from yesterday.

Show me a study that shows that playing not to lose is a better way to win than playing to win, and I’ll believe you’re not just being a conservative traditionalist because,well, that’s what old conservative people have said, so it must be true.

Oh, and Marcus Coker disagrees that running keeps the ball away better than throwing.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes. Dumb to cite evidence.

Yes, Coker is a bumbler, and should be judged on 4 career fumbles over 8 career games, with at least two of those games in heavy rain.

Yes, playing to win never results in mistakes or turnovers that could possible actually create a loss. That is why everyone loves turnovers and the late-game chaos they cause.

Yes, old conservative people are stupid, and should be lambasted at every opportunity. “Look at how dumb they are, they don’t even smoke weed or snort cocaine or get really drunk. Fucking dumbasses.”

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ummm

Don’t you actually have to cite evidence to claim that you have cited evidence?

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 2:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

I cited several shootouts this year and Tyger dismissed them.

But, according to many comments on this thread, apparently we are supposed to make decisions based on a selected quarter or two of a game.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

What is trending right in front of your fucking face

should weigh more then what happened last year; This is college football…

And what did you actually cite instead of just claim that it was calculated or probabilities? Sorry, but fucking bullshit…

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 3:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

dude, your evidence was crap.

Why did you not allow that the opposing coach probably liked the shootout? You can’t really be that stupid. You really didn’t think that if Pinkel et al. hated the outcome of their shootout at the other coach would obviously love it? Seriously? I mean, c’mon.

Tell me you at least thought that and just decided to ignore it because it didn’t help your case, and you hoped someone else wasn’t smart enough to think of it. Please tell me you’re not a fucking moron who didn’t think that a winning coach would be happy the way the game played out. Please tell me you were just being deceptive and not completely, utterly stupid.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 12, 2011 1:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

Again,

thanks for just be dismissive and moving right into the name-calling.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 13, 2011 5:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

just being

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 13, 2011 5:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

Hello pot...

That’s exactly what you did with your first comment to my thoughts…

You’re one strange cookie… you said it’s just college football and you have too much stress in your life to worry about it. Yet you stay up past midnight to continuously comment. Then come back again for more…

Just a bit of advice… stop digging…

by Grixxly on Sep 13, 2011 8:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

No, citing evidence is not bad.

But you cited ridiculously poor evidence. I was able to “counter” your shit evidence with my own shit evidence. We didn’t make any progress in our debate.

You don’t understand the concept of small sample sizes. For every team that you said hated the shoot out, you didn’t seem to grasp that the opposing coach was happy with the shoot out. I can’t argue with someone who is acting that hard-headed.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 12, 2011 1:36 AM CDT up reply actions  

Running doesn't keep it away from teh other team

If you’re not getting the yardage. And for a long stretch, we weren’t.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe, maybe not.

I was just talking with a guy the other day, his son is an FCS defensive assistant coach.

His son has specifically noticed the difference in the adjustments he can make, while his players are on the bench with him, when his own offense is running more or passing more.

So, if we start chucking it and not running much, it could have some negative effects. Not so much at the end of a game, but maybe in other parts of the game.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

What the hell are you talking about?

The passing game was working incredibly well to start the game while the running game was spotty. And, more importantly, ISU was selling out to stop the run. So, what do we do? We play right into their hands and continued to do so despite evidence that it wasn’t working. That had disastrous results: Vandy lost his confidence and got out of rhythm and Coker took far more pounding and fumbled, which only made him more tentative going forward. If we had passed, bad things might have happened. But bad things were most certainly happening when we were running it and we just kept beating our head against that wall in the seeming believe that the brick will give out before our skulls would

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think it was quite that bad.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

you might want to go look at the drive charts for the game. it's not exactly as black and white as you recall.

"So, the caterpillar has emerged from its cocoon as a shark, with a gun for a mouth" - M. Burns

by rupertj on Sep 11, 2011 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Regarding the blitzes,

as others said in the comments following: ISU’s OL might be their strength, particularly Osemele. Every second the QB isn’t tackled is a second that an O-Lineman can use to get in the way of the DL/LB, or hold them, or maybe actually block them.

I never expected Jantz to have that type of success, because I thought we’d get to him eventually. But sometime later this week, I may also go back and count the number of times our defensive front players fell down, or got tripped up, or whatever.

Also, our DBs are still sub-par (except Prater), so eventually the ISU WRs and TEs get open, and Jantz just throws it to them. And it seems like ISU’s #7 decided to actually try to play a game and catch against Iowa, rather than play mental games and drop 5 passes like he did against UNI.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 12:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

On the blitzing

Parker’s system on linebackers is pretty simple: Strongside LB (Nielsen) is on the tight end side and responsible for the TE/slot in the flat. Weakside LB is responsible for run cut-back and the weakside flat. That means, if they’re going to blitz, Iowa’s going to do it from the weakside for minimal effect on coverages (it also helps that the WLB, Kirksey, is the ideal guy for blitzing).

ISU spent Saturday attacking the sidelines (the weakness of cover 2/quarters) and rolling Jantz toward the tight end/slot receiver, mostly because that’s where the most options were. That meant that when Iowa blitzed from the WLB, Jantz was already rolling toward the SLB, and you saw what happened. The ideal adjustment would have been to blitz from the strongside and force Jantz to stay in the pocket or scramble away from his options. Which haha defensive adjustment good one. I honestly wouldn’t be surprised if there wasn’t even a strongside blitz in the playbook.

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Great summary, Patrick.

Also, in quarters, safeties have to force (corners do not force in most cover 4 schemes). I think our safeties are just not there yet. Just replaying the games in my mind I don’t recall any Hyde/Sleeper missile shots yet. This part of our game can get better.

And of course Parker is unusual in that the SAM is required to run with the slot on any wheel route out of the flat. So he’s being run out of the play, often.

Thinking about Jantz’ game while watching some NFL yesterday: there is none of this running-in-circles stuff by the QB in the NFL, because the QB wouldn’t last a half before the ambulance call. But our commitment to zone coverage means we simply have to get pressure with four, and we simply didn’t. I’m not so surprised at Daniel having a quiet day; much more surprised that Binns and Daniels were quiet. Right now it seems Alvis is our most disruptive D-lineman.

We play tackle football.

by Bellanca on Sep 12, 2011 7:45 AM CDT up reply actions  

My 2c

Fuck

by txhawkeye on Sep 11, 2011 11:39 AM CDT via iPhone app reply actions   1 recs

Thoughts a day later

1.McNutt was not used enough what the hell was that about?
2. Isn’t Iowa know for having stud TE and where the hell were they yesterday?
3. ISU might be a damn good football team. I know I am being a heretic here but damn did you watch the game?
4. Coker will be fine but damn give him some rest and try the other guys out.
5. VB needs to learn what pass to throw when. zip it not always float it….. I know he did okay but did make some questionable choices.
6. 1:17 left and no pass play down the field to McNutt? That had me wondering what the hell was going on.
7. Iowa terrible I don’t think so. Need to improve yes ready to throw in the towel not even close.
8. Yes we have problems with mobile QB’s Norm will I hope get some idea how to deal with this.

by nwyms Trebek! on Sep 11, 2011 11:48 AM CDT reply actions   1 recs

One thing that's being discounted

is how solid ISU was in the trenches yesterday. On both sides of the ball. They have a pretty good O-line and their D-line plugged up holes pretty well most of the day, letting their linebackers make the tackles they were supposed to.

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 11, 2011 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

ISU

doesn’t have enough defense or offensive skill players outside of Jantz. If they stay really healthy all year long, they may make a bowl. If not, things will get dicey.

These guys are not Texas Tech from 2008. They will not be contending with OU and OSU/Texas/A&M/Mizzou late in the year. Jantz played great against Iowa, but he also threw 3 picks to an FCS team in the UNI game. Wait until a defense hits him a few times (and somebody will, even if they have to wait until OU).

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't know.

Reynolds, Darks, Johnson, White, Lenz and That Other Guy What Come From California With Jantz all looked pretty goddamn skilled to me.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, then maybe they should have done something against UNI.

Reynolds looks good, but he spent the whole UNI game taunting and trying to goad fights, and dropping or volleyball-setting what should have been easy catches.

Johnson is quick, but very small. Also, he ran for a whopping 220 yards all of last year.

Lenz and Darks might be OK. Or, they might just be able to get open after Jantz runs around for 20 seconds.

White didn’t do much before overtime.

Maybe they have more skills than I think, but I also feel like they’ll be exposed when the play some defenses with D-1 athletes, or a defense that isn’t so averse to blitzing straight at the QB (rather unlike Iowa).

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Do you remember 2009 at all?

ISU should have been pissed as Hell for losing to us with that logic.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 2:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think 2009 Iowa is/was more talented than the current ISU team.

Yes, both won close games against UNI.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe we should be happy

We don’t play UNI this year.

by GaryDolphinSafeTuna on Sep 11, 2011 3:13 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

Is that going to be your only response

that ISU looked bad against UNI? Because we did as well. And clearly that had no long-term repercussions for us. You seem insistent that at some point ISU was simply going to implode on itself for the sole fact that it had struggled against UNI the week before. That’s not an argument, that’s simply faith in the face of overwhelming evidence.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

All I'm saying is Jantz is averaging 1.5 picks per game this season,

and for the Iowa game, he played better than that.

He’s averaging 2.5 passing TDs per game, and for the Iowa game, he played better than that.

There was a reasonable viewpoint that said he might not do as well as he ended up doing in OT.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

i don't want to get in the middle of anything

But… Of /course/ his best game out of two is going to be better than the average of those two. Saying he’s going to regress to the average of one game is dumb. What are you going to say if he’s even better next week, when suddenly this week’s game is “average”? Because at that point your logic is in the toilet.

by pfoley on Sep 11, 2011 11:28 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

Well, it is a function of having so little of his performance to base my judgment on.

I don’t know how good he was at the JC in California.

I was at the UNI vs ISU game, so from that, I knew Jantz could run it, but I also expected him to throw a pick or two. It didn’t happen.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 12:33 AM CDT up reply actions  

wow, i just don't....

Just when i thought…

But two…

cuz you hafta consider…

just because you…

the rotor…

..

.

by GreatBarrierReiff on Sep 12, 2011 2:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

I think its pretty simple

we got outplayed and we got outcoached. It was becoming more and more apparent during the game that Iowa didnt deserve to win, and the fact that they managed to hang around to triple overtime is amazing to me.

I think you need to play around with the freshman in the DB and DL position a little more. the starters didnt fill me with confidence. We also really really want Burnside back.

i think the Iowa staff is one of the best development coaching staffs in the nation, and one of the worst gameday staffs in the nation as well. These last few years have just solidified that for me. Go to Iowa if you want to go to the NFL, but dont go if you want to win the national championship.

"Your spelling and grammar errors belie a seriously skilled thought process"- therealCatnuts

by justsomehawkeyefan on Sep 11, 2011 12:01 PM CDT reply actions  

Also, tackling drills.

lots and lots of tackling drills because apparently they thought Tennessee tech was a fluke. now you know its not the rain, so tackling drills please

"Your spelling and grammar errors belie a seriously skilled thought process"- therealCatnuts

by justsomehawkeyefan on Sep 11, 2011 12:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Tackling has been shockingly poor thus far.

Lots of arm tackling. Players colliding with, not running through, opponents. Uncharacteristically weak fundamentals on defense.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 12:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

This has kinda been an issue for a couple years running now.

To start out the season, anyway. But yeah, just shit-awful tackling so far this year.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 12:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

Iowa fans (yes, me too) talking about a national championship

is dumb. We’ve been within striking distance of the Big Game twice under Ferentz (02, 09). But, don’t act like the coaching staff can make all the breaks it would take to get us there, and they just refuse to do so.

Hayden Fry is God, but he lost every big bowl game he went to. Iowa is not rolling in national title chances, and may never.

Let’s criticize the coaches for actual problems (defense in disarray, offensive lack of cajones) before we go back to the “imaginary criticism” well.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

I honestly don't understand why UW and Nebraska can be title contenders and Iowa can't.

What is the inherent advantage to those schools? Is it that most of the fanbase thinks like you and doesn’t expect or almost even care if they’re in contention for a national title? Is it a coach’s mindset? It seems like a lot of people accept it , and I don’t understand why.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 12:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

In fairness, Wisky hasn't really been in contention for a national title much more than Iowa.

And Nebby has the cache to start higher in the polls (even when they shouldn’t be).

Basically, you appear to be saying Iowa fans should always expect to win every game (or, in the most fortunate of BCS circumstances, win all but one per season). Otherwise we are a bunch of pussy losers who might as well become ISU fans.

I want to win every game, but I’m not going to become chicken little when ISU catches us once in awhile. I’m not going to wet my pants when a good Iowa team (2010) loses games to a good Wisky team or a bunch of athletic-freak-cheaters like OSU.

The jNW thing is eating at me a bit. Or maybe that’s Fitzgerald trying to bite my buttocks. BEGONE, COACH WIZGERALD!!! AND TAKE THAT POTATO WITH YOU!!!

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

But my question is, why do we accept that?

Why do we just blindly say, “Well, Nebraska has more cache than Iowa and that’s how it will always be.”

and no, I never called anyone names, but thanks for the straw man.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

whoa, whoa. What makes you think that UW is any more of a title contender than Iowa?

Simply because they’re hotter right now?

"So, the caterpillar has emerged from its cocoon as a shark, with a gun for a mouth" - M. Burns

by rupertj on Sep 11, 2011 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

Bielema hasn't a bad season yet.

Ferentz has had four.

And yeah, time will tell,but to me, UW sure seems to be on a higher level recently, and I see little reason to think they’ll drop.

Since Bielema took over in 2006, he has 3 10-win seasons out of the past 5. And it sure looks they’ll add a fourth out of six. In the same time at Iowa (so you can’t say he “inherited” a bare cupboard), Ferentz has one. And I have strong doubts that they only lose one more game the rest of the year. And while recruiting clases and stars don’t mean a lot, they do mean something. And UW’s class this year is shaping up to be better than Iowa’s.

You’re right to question my certainty of their betterness, but I do think the evidence points in that direction, if not roundly confirms it. So “hotter right now” means, during Bielema’s entire tenure from the very first year, and Ferentz’s 2nd half of his.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think this is the most true thing I've ever read

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ferentz has spent more time, even before being Iowa HC,

as a college assistant or head coach than he did as a pro assistant.

And if you have ever said that KF’s pro experience was a benefit, I think it is quite douchey to call it a liability now.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not commenting as to its liability or benefit at all, but merely commenting on the reality at hand.

It is what it is. Both approaches have pros & cons.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think the merit of this conceit

is that Ferentz’ decision-making often seems more consistent with a 48-quarter game, followed by a month of practice and the one, real, four-quarter game.

On the coaches’ boards they’re still swooning over what Iowa did to Georgia Tech.

We play tackle football.

by Bellanca on Sep 12, 2011 7:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

This is splitting hairs

But Wisconsin has definitely had a bad season in the form of the 2008 edition which temporarily had Bielema on the hot seat.

"I hope we're not looking past Alabama to Temple the next Saturday." - Jack Ham

by ReadingRambler on Sep 11, 2011 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

eh, they still won more games than Iowa did that year or the year before.

I know fans thought it was a horrible year, but that’s because Wisconsinans have higher standards than Iowans.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

No, it *was* a horrible year.

Wisconsin lost to a terrible Michigan team for their first defeat. They stayed close with Ohio State because Ohio State was sloppy but still lost. They then played a pathetic drubbing of a game against Penn State, lost to every other decent team they could find, and got destroyed by Florida State in the bowl game. I think Wisconsin was one of the worst winning teams I’ve ever seen and Bielema had to work very hard to overcome the amount of hatred that was flowing in his direction.

"I hope we're not looking past Alabama to Temple the next Saturday." - Jack Ham

by ReadingRambler on Sep 11, 2011 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

I hate this bull

and Nebraska and Boise proved it wrong by being national title contenders despite having the same and less advantages that Iowa has, so its pointless self defeating bullcrap that Iowa fans are all to quick to jump on.

Boise like it or not has been very close to a national title despite living in idaho and being in the minor leagues and did i mention they are in fucking idaho?, Nebraska has won multiple national titles while being Nebraska. your telling me those two schools had major advantages in their day over Iowa? keep dreaming.

i can guarantee you this, not one team who has ever won a championship said "we cant do it because insert reason here, in fact, not one person has ever done anything worth doing by stating that they couldnt do it for whatever reason. so as long as people continue to think we cant because we are lesser somehow despite evidence to the contrary, we actually wont.

Iowa, the school not the coaching staff, is just as capable as any school in the nation of winning a national title in football.

"Your spelling and grammar errors belie a seriously skilled thought process"- therealCatnuts

by justsomehawkeyefan on Sep 11, 2011 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Nebraska certainly does have (or did in the 1990s)

advantages that Iowa did not. First, their stadium seats thousands more than Kinnick. That’s a ton of money rolling in, that paid for more recruiting trips to California and other places.

And Boise has not, in totality, been closer than Iowa to a national title game at the end of a year. Iowa has been #3, and that’s as high as Boise has been.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

On paper they may not have been any closer

But they also have serious disadvantages compared to Iowa, and have been more consistently close to the top 5 over the last 5 years. If Boise can be mentioned in the national title picture every year for the last three years or so despite all its disadvantages, i dont see why Iowa cant win one.

and when the only advantage a former championship school has over yours is bigger stadium, well im sorry but its not enough for me to give up on. besides last time i checked Iowa is doing damn well on the money department.

its self fulfilling prophesy. if a team doesnt think they will win a national title they wont, and if its fans dont believe they ever will, then they wont either because the players actually do hear the fans. look at the Cubs. there is no “curse”, its just every time they get close the fans and media talk about the curse and the team starts subconsciously believing that they wont win because they never have.

"Your spelling and grammar errors belie a seriously skilled thought process"- therealCatnuts

by justsomehawkeyefan on Sep 11, 2011 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

If you don't think Nebraska has advantages over Iowa,

you are not paying attention. National TV appearances, media coverage, cash, higher-rated recruiting, (and up until this year, they had an easier path to a one-game-shot at a conference title through their very weak division of the B12).

Also, Boise has to play 3, maybe 4 tough-ish games a year. Iowa usually has decent teams (bowl-bound, winning squads) as opponents more often that.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think we are talking about two different Nebraskas

Im talking about when Nebraska was not a 5 time champion. right now yes, but back when they werent a 5 time champion they didnt have any real advantages.

"Your spelling and grammar errors belie a seriously skilled thought process"- therealCatnuts

by justsomehawkeyefan on Sep 11, 2011 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe.

They got way more national TV coverage, attendance, and cash even back in the 1980s, and probably in the 1970s too.

Nebraska vs OU is usually considered one of the top 3 or 5 college football rivalries, and I think national media helped make that happen.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

Never a NC with Ferentz as head coach

If we were able to get 4-5 star recruits year in and year out like OU or Alabama maybe, but under KF’s conservative style and middling talent I’ll never expect to compete for a NC title. There’s no killer instinct in Ferentz.

 Look at Bielema, sure he’s a dik, but he’s willing to step on the opponents neck. He doesn’t need to be liked by the other coaches. Iowa and Wisky battle for pretty much the same recruits so the talent is on par. The difference is Bielema is willing to put it on the other team, hurt feelings or not.

KF is old school in an era where you need to adapt to quick, no huddle spread offenses and multiple look defenses.

I think I’m willing to accept a prick as a Head coach as long as I know he’s willing to do anything(legally;) to play for the win.

For now we’ll have to settle for Iowa being a good developmental program and seeing our alumni playing on Sundays….

by IAinCA on Sep 11, 2011 8:36 PM CDT via iPhone app up reply actions  

There's a slight difference

I’ll never fault Ferentz for not running up the score on overmatched teams. That to me shows true character. And make no mistake, that is what Bielema does, and often, just because he can. And it’s what makes him a prick. It is possible to have the killer instinct while not being needlessly cruel. Ferentz needs more of the former, Bielema needs far less of the latter.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 8:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

I tend not to get too pissed at Bielema,

until he does something like needlessly go for two.

I’m not even sure I’m angry at him about the whole “weird kickoff rule thing against PSU” from a few years back.

Still, I don’t know what it is, but I’m glad KF is our coach compared to Bielema. Wisconsin has had a few kids get some (usually minor) NCAA violations over the last ten years or so (can’t remember if they were all under Alvarez or if some were under Bielema). I haven’t really seen the same from athletes under Ferentz (yes, we could talk about the litany of other law-breaking, but I’m not going to.)

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 11:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

They were all under Alvarez

and it was incredibly minor, petty shit where the NCAA over-reacted. It was a situation where some athletes got a discount at a shoe store, that also gave a similar (if not the same) discount to regular students. It was the definition of “everyone is doing it” where there is no real violation (and one that I have no doubts Iowa has been “guilty” of in the past, present and/or future).

I don’t really get pissed at Bielema, but I do think he’s something of a prick. And I’m glad Ferentz isn’t like that. I just wish Ferentz had a little more of the killer instinct Bielema has (though Bielema takes it way, way too far).

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 12:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

Thanks for the info and the honest opinion on killer instinct.

So maybe Alvarez wasn’t as great as I remember.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 12:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

Don't mind me

I’m just reccing the fuck out of this post

by GreatBarrierReiff on Sep 12, 2011 3:02 AM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Rec'd for your name.

Also, I love coral, so…


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 12, 2011 7:24 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think Bielema takes it too far or

at least no farther than Fry used to. If BB ran up 80 pts. on an FCS program, OK, then that’s dick-ish. However, if he wants to drop 70 on a conference opponent, fuckin’ a, he should; it’s their job to stop you. The 70 pts. isn’t on him, it’s on the opposition.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 12, 2011 2:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

YES.

Exactly. It’s only viewed as dickish by Iowa fans because our own coach won’t fucking do it himself even though deep down (and in many cases not-so-deep-down) the vast majority of Hawkeye fans wish he would, and often. Hayden did, and we fucking loved it. I think most of us also love the class restraint politeness Ned Flandersishness class that Ferentz shows in this regard, but you’re deluding yourself if you think that running up of the score would suddenly not go over well in the 319.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 12, 2011 7:29 AM CDT up reply actions  

I, for one, am not a fan of it

If the 70 (or whatever the big number happens to be) is necessary to win, then so be it. Or if our second unit happens to break some big runs and score, I have no problem with that either. But the point of a game is to find out which team is better and can score more points. Once you’re up 40, there’s really no doubt as to who the better team is, right? So why is it even necessary to score more? And I’m only talking about when the game is not in doubt (4th quarter, or perhaps sooner against a lower-level opponent). Different strokes, I guess.

"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe

by Brock8144 on Sep 12, 2011 9:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

But say a team is up 30 and the game isn't in doubt.

I’ve always felt that this is one of the more dangerous situations on the football field, not from a competitive standpoint, but from one of actual physical danger.

On one side you have kids who are embarrassed and angry and on the other side you have kids who are no longer sharp and aggressive, but relaxed and complacent. This is when injuries happen.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 12, 2011 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

It's not gonna be often that a 30 point game isn't in doubt

but at whatever point it’s not, I have no problem with still trying to score. But up 30 by the 4th quarter? Get the 2nd stringers in there and run out the clock.

"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe

by Brock8144 on Sep 12, 2011 7:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'd take Bielema as HC in a heartbeat.

That does NOT mean I don’t want KF to be Iowa’s coach or that I don’t want him to continue to be Iowa’s coach in the future. But, if suddenly KF retired/went to the NFL/ceased to exist/was beamed back to his home planet/etc, and Bielema were magically available…. well, shit son, come on back home.
That will never happen, and really cannot happen now that he’s a fell B1G team’s coach, but you know, fantasy world, all things being equal, bob’s your uncle, yadda yadda yadda, you’re fucking A right I’d want Bielema.
I didn’t’ used to feel that way, but fuck it. He wins games, his teams are fun to watch, and his kids sure seem to love him and love playing for him, and, there is zero evidence (or even any suggestion thereof) that he runs anything but a clean and respectful program.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 12, 2011 7:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

appreciate the level head

Yesterday was certainly frustrating. Not so much the loss but how iowa lost. Certainly hindsight throws some of the playcalling into question but what really bothers me was kirk not trying to get points either at the end of the 4th and not going for it on 4th and 1 in OT. But thanks for the writeup. Hopefully the coaching staff can learn a lot from the tape.

impossible is nothing

by RGates on Sep 11, 2011 12:51 PM CDT via mobile reply actions  

I have a problem with questioning the FG in OT.

The argument seems to be “Well, we knew we weren’t going to stop them, so why not try for a TD?” But OT goes indefinitely unless a defense gets a stop. If you have a mindset that you can’t get a stop, then why not just give up once you get to OT? And if you don’t score at all in OT, you’re basically telling your defense “You’ve got 3 plays to get a turnover. Good Luck.”

"So, the caterpillar has emerged from its cocoon as a shark, with a gun for a mouth" - M. Burns

by rupertj on Sep 11, 2011 1:05 PM CDT reply actions  

Well, did we stop them?

And, given how they had played in the second half, wouldn’t the best thing for Iowa be getting ISU’s field goal unit on the field?

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes. I can't recall a time at Trice where ISU field goals were the difference.

/sarcasm font.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

Our kicker was hot as hell.

There’s had one great kick, then two HORRIBLE shanks. This was one of the few areas where I thought we had an advantage.

But not in OT. We needed TD’s in OT the way our defense was playing.

"Apparently, riding Joe Paterno like a small horse is FROWNED UPON IN THIS ESTABLISHMENT!"

by The Director on Sep 11, 2011 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

1:17 and two timeouts...

This is what makes me the most upset. 1:17 and two timeouts is an ass ton of time in college (see UM v ND) and instead of going for the win we play for OT?!?! WTF??? I would have much rather lost to a pick 6 or fumble going for it then what we did.

And how much is that decision going to hurt the confidence of the Offense? KF can talk up the Offense as much as he wants but his actions show otherwise and those players are smart enough to see that. A pick 6 or fumble going for it would at least have been a teachable moment, but instead… Now I’m not saying the sky is falling but I do think that decision did much more harm then losing the game.

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 1:19 PM CDT reply actions  

You think that decision hurts the O's confidence

more than a game-winning pick six or fumble recovery would hurt it?

I thought I was supposed to be the irrational one around here.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

And agreed.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree with Grixxly.

Boy do I.

To limp out of ISU with a loss like we did will last more than a few days, it was a real confidence shaker.

But to have “gone out swinging,” with a real what-the-hell attitude is something I think would’ve been far less harmful of a loss (not to mention not having to put the team through something as physically and emotionally stressful as OT).

We curled up into the fetal position and hoped ISU (who had outplayed us most of the game) would make some mistake and we’d eke out the win. Not only didn’t that happen, it was 99% predictable that this would not happen.

"Apparently, riding Joe Paterno like a small horse is FROWNED UPON IN THIS ESTABLISHMENT!"

by The Director on Sep 11, 2011 1:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

Right.

Because this experience, on the road, in 3 OT, won’t possibly ready us for similar scenarios later in the year.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

Right.

And your coach saying by actions that you aren’t good enough to move the ball and give us a chance to win couldn’t possibly hurt the team.

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 1:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

I can name times where late-game TOs killed a team.

The confidence issue has less clear evidence.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

Probably even more times where a QB leads a team...

….down the field and gives their kicker a decent shot at a win. Or, like in the Michigan game, DOES get the win.

"Apparently, riding Joe Paterno like a small horse is FROWNED UPON IN THIS ESTABLISHMENT!"

by The Director on Sep 11, 2011 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

I can name more times when going for it and achieving victory had the biggest boost

in a team’s confidence. Seriously, single cases are the dumbest way to make an argument like this.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes.

Because evidence is over-rated.

You’ve had several comments on this post about “I can’t think of many examples” or “I’m too lazy to do the research.” And that’s fine. I’m like that sometimes, too.

But don’t use it as a way to dismiss the concrete examples that others offer. It just makes you look like you’re in a bad mood, particularly when you start giving people the business for their “moral victory/defeatist mind-set.”

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

The plural of "anecdote" is not "data"

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

How about if it was about 4 or 5 pieces?

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

Please study the difference

between “correlation” and “causation”. Because it appears you don’t know the difference.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 4:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'd rather take a quick loss than a gut-wrenching 3 OT loss.

Absolutely. I don’t see much of a silver lining benefit to how yesterday’s game ended. It was kind of a confidence crusher for the offense on three separate occasions: letting the clock expire, not going for two, not going on 4th and 1.

"Apparently, riding Joe Paterno like a small horse is FROWNED UPON IN THIS ESTABLISHMENT!"

by The Director on Sep 11, 2011 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

At least there are probabilities to support those decisions.

You’d think one of them would have paid off.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

WHAT FUCKING PROBABILITIES?!?!

Cite me on single fucking probability or just quit saying this.

I’m saying that it sure seems like what this team currenlty does doesn’t lead to a lot of wins, and why not try something new? You keep saying no, the way the team operates leads to more wins, and I have the numbers to back it up.

YET YOU WON’T REVEAL YOUR NUMBERS!!! You could seriously end this whole debate if you would just give us the numbers you’re privy to. I’m very willing to change my stance on things when presented with evidence. But you refuse to share because you want the numbers for yourself (or because you don’t have them, but I refuse to believe that because someone so confident that they’re right wouldn’t be so and wouldn’t refer to probabilities without actually having, you know, probabilities.)

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Do you really think that teams with more turnovers win more?

And if you looked at ISU’s offensive performance at any time this year up until overtime (and it was difficult to predict they would go ape-shit in OT), then the probabilities would say that our defense might stop them at least one out of three times.

Going for 2 is low-probability, and if I have to explain that to you, then how the fuck are you able to log in and type sentences?

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

Okay... now I think you've officially gone over the edge
And if you looked at ISU’s offensive performance at any time this year up until overtime (and it was difficult to predict they would go ape-shit in OT)

You’re fucking kidding right? Their last three drives went for 73 yards, 71 yards, 74 yards. It didn’t take a magic 8-ball to figure out that we couldn’t stop them…

I’m starting to think you’re like my brother-in-law and just like to argue for the sake of argument; regardless if you have a leg to stand on…

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 2:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, you're close.

It was 71, 73, and 59 yards. Two were passing TDs, one was a missed FG.

Which makes me think we may have kept them from running very well. Their lack of running success, plus Jantz’s (albeit, short) ISU history of some turnovers, plus the ISU kicking issues, make me think we had a chance to beat them in OT.

Believe me, I’m not arguing just to argue. I’m doing so based on some facts. Or evidence, if you prefer.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Acording to SI.com

it was 73, 71, 74 here What’s your cite?

Actually I’d prefer some evidence instead of your postulating… seriously.

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

I looked at the drive charts on the ESPN box score.

http://espn.go.com/ncf/drivechart?gameId=312530066

But please, don’t let that stop your anger. (not seriously)

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not angry

and I’m not delusional. My cite is different from your cite but at least you actually provided a cite, for once.

And regardless, using your cite still shows our Defense could not stop them. Your cite still shows that our Offense scored on 3 of it’s last 4 possessions. So… sorry… your ‘evidence’ only reinforces my point.

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ah.

He’s going for the “your evidence only makes my point for me” dollar. That’s a smart move.

/Bill Hicks’d

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ah... the smoke and mirrors play

Please… Really please. Tell me how I am wrong. Does your cite not also say that Iowa scored on 3 of its last 4 possessions and that the Defense couldn’t stop ISU on their last 3 possessions?

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 3:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

Perhaps I'm interpreting the stats differently,

but I don’t think Vandy was (or was ever going to be) all-world yesterday. Some of those “scores” were FGs, not TDs.

And, not having stopped ISU may mean that they are somewhat due for some failure on their part. Because ISU is not going to score 5 TDs a game and Jantz is not going to have a perfect passer rating in perpetuity.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

Chazz, if you're the lone sane person in this forum then you should give up trying to convince lunatics of your point.

Or you could admit that you’re wrong and just stop for that reason. Either way, stop.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 11, 2011 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

I know I'm not the "lone sane person."

And I’m fine with criticizing KF for his decisions.

I think it is bad to call him a coward or an idiot. I think it is bad to not admit that there might be information out there that could lead to the decisions he and his staff made.

I’m particularly miffed at how everyone here knew ISU was such a great offensive team, except we were all predicting an Iowa win by a TD, or two, or three, or 4.

BHGP is slowly turning into the place where demonizing KF is really cool. I always expected an amount of demonizing KOK, but it is baffling at how awesome the Hawks are when we beat a decent team (like MSU, or GT, or PSU) but how retarded the coaches become when we get caught by ISU, or jNW, or Minnesota, or when we lose to an equal or “superior” opponent. It’s BCS football. Anyone can lose at any time. We are not immune!

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

Jesus christ are you a ten-year-old?

No one is saying KF is a coward or an idiot; what’s being said is that decisions made by him yesterday seemed/were cowardly and questionable (if not idiotic). It’s not that binary, not that black & white. We can say he made bad or even terrible calls without meaning that he himself is a bad or even terrible person. It’s called nuance. It’s what adults do.
And there’s no trend of “demonizing” anyone, much less is said perceived trend some new “cool” thing that all us cool kids are doing. No one’s suddenly bashing on your Honorable Captain or His character or questioning that He’s the right man for The Job.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions   2 recs

Actually, on this one, I think Chazz is right.
These were obvious mistakes, made by a man who is either an idiot or a coward.

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." - Teddy Roosevelt

by HawKCP on Sep 11, 2011 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

Right, because nuance is so much better.

Commentors and writers on here have been, at times, insinuating that KF is bad because of the DJK, A-Rob, and game-calling situations. And, as HawkCP points out, we finally resorted to name-calling today.

Criticism is fine. I was also disappointed that we didn’t do something better at the end of each half yesterday. But some people around here are throwing KF under the bus. I don’t care for it.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

We know Chazz

Because it’s never KF’s fault. And, to your mind, NO ONE can question him without being irrational and wanting him fired. And despite people trying to discuss other optiosn with you, you stick to an unsupported, binary if/or position and refuse to see any position other than your own as having merit.

Here’s the thing, going into the game, I thought Jantz wasn’t going to be very good, that he would make mistakes and Iowa would take advantage. But by the end of the 4th qtr, it was clear that wasn’t the case that day and it wasn’t likely to come true as we went forward. That’s why playing for OT was the wrong decision. Or rather, not even trying to go for the win, and abandoning all trust in your offense in doing so. Every time Ferentz was given the option to be bold, to at least fight for the win, he shrank from the occasion. And that, in the context of yesterday’s game, made him cowardly.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah,

but it isn’t always KF’s fault, either. And we are approaching that mentality around here.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

The decisions that are his

ARE his fault. And it was his decisions yesterday that were the problem with the game in the balance.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 9:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

Penalties didn't help, either.

It was “only” 35 yards worth, but there were 6 of them, including one near the end of regulation.

Sure, give the biggest chunk of the blame to Ferentz’s decision-making, but I think at least 10 to 20% of the blame can be shared by others, too.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 11:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't really think the penalties had any effect

and the one near the end of regulation (a false start) was meaningless because KF had already made clear he wasn’t going to go for it – it occurred on the second snap, or after the first running play.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 12:42 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not sure one running play

definitively means you are not trying to move the ball.

Now, two running plays did mean exactly that.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 12:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

See below

But the formation and run called definitely said “we’re not trying”. The penalty just made it definitive.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 12:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

not true, if you believe what Kirk says

In the post game he said the penalty did make a difference.

"So, the caterpillar has emerged from its cocoon as a shark, with a gun for a mouth" - M. Burns

by rupertj on Sep 12, 2011 7:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

That is nothing more than post hoc

rationalization and ass-covering. As disappointed as I was by his in-game decisions, I was even more pissed at Ferentz for a number of his post-game answers.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 9:28 AM CDT up reply actions  

says you. I for one thought he looked pissed during the presser

but he was still trying to give his usual calm answers

"So, the caterpillar has emerged from its cocoon as a shark, with a gun for a mouth" - M. Burns

by rupertj on Sep 12, 2011 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah.

But was he pissed because they lost, or pissed because he had to actually maybe answer questions about it?
I mean, I know the loss itself pissed him off, but I think being questioned about anything pisses him off even more.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 12, 2011 1:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

THIS

so much this.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

I do too

Give them the chance and they fail? They learn, just as 2008 learned.

Take it out of their hands? Coach just said we can’t get 50 yards in a minute and a half against Iowa State, guys.

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

Did we get 50 yards against Wisky when he needed to last year?

Maybe our offense still has improvements to make, too.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

You don't seem to get it...

KF basically told the Offense I don’t believe in you…

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

I stuck up for KF against OSU.

Vandy was a frosh, he’d already thrown picks, had gone cold passing, and so on.

But NONE of those applied yesterday. Vandy is no longer a frosh. He had zero picks yesterday. He had a good 4th quarter.

On the other hand, the defense was sucking eggs. Not much of a choice to me: go for it and see what happens.

"Apparently, riding Joe Paterno like a small horse is FROWNED UPON IN THIS ESTABLISHMENT!"

by The Director on Sep 11, 2011 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

You don't seem to get it

that making calculated decisions is not the same as calling your offense a bunch of failures.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

What calculated decision?

1:17 and two timeouts is a ton of time? What calculated decision?

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

THIS

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 2:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

Can't you mean bullies just stop making fun of Captain Kirk already?

He doesn’t do drugs or listen to music with swearing and he’s humble and does things the right way and you’re all being a bunch of mean old meanies with saying he made bad calls yesterday because that’s mean.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Come on, dude.

Throwing the ball to get more than half a field with a QB in his third start, and WRs that seem to pick bad times to stop catching, on the road, in 1:20 is rather risky.

That’s why it was “calculated” to run it and play for OT. Maybe not what I would have done, but not retardedly-coward-like, either.

If the players don’t know that KF and staff have confidence in them, then they will never know it. And, we are young at many positions.

And Tyger is arguing just to argue at this point.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

That same QB

scored 3 of the last 4 possessions… That same defense allowed 3 consecutive drives of over 70 yards…

How you don’t see that KF nut-punched the offense is beyond me and you don’t seem to actually cite or provide any information to the contrary.

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

It has nothing to do with our questioning of the reality of the situation;

I’m now convinced it’s nothing more than our questioning of Ferentz in any way, shape, or form, as Chazz appears to be one with a real problem with questioning authority in any way, and one who fetishizes KF and his character and his “right man for the job-edness” to the point of deification.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

Questioning is fine.

Saying things like “KF nut-punched the offense” or calling him a coward or an idiot, is childish.

I like and admire KF. He has faults. If they are shown to be faults that severely hurt the program, then I’ll eat crow. But we went 9-0 only two years ago, and won a BCS bowl. Things we don’t do often. So let’s chill on the “KF is going to crash the plane into the mountain” bullshit.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

Take a moment

And actually explain how it wasn’t a nut punch? I gave you the evidence. The Offense scored on 3 of its last 4 possessions and the Defense gave up 70+ yards on the last 3 ISU possessions…

Tell me how playing for OT wasn’t a nut punch?

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 3:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Because the players are wearing cups?

By the way, 3 of those 4 possessions were a rushing TD, and two FGs. Sounds like a minute left and two TOs with a TE and a WR that have drops on the day means we should definitely WING IT, BITCHES!!!!

WOOOOOOOOO! FUN AND GUN! THE GHOST OF REX GROSSMAN RIDES AGAIN!!!!!

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

You know what... fuck you

Your absurd defensive nature is incredible, taxing, and boring… And I thought I was overly defensive of Iowa coaches (ask Ross). You take the cake.

Also, do you cringe when someone says God Damn it! instead of Cheese and Rice!? You know that’s just semantics and it means the same thing right?

You claim to cite evidence and yet fail to do so. You can’t explain why OT was the better choice when asked… and several times I might add…

You fail to address the actual evidence provided by posters and then state you’re the only sane one in the room… Have fun fucker…

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 3:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

Actually, I said

“I know I’m not the Lone Sane Person.”

And, I’m running with some generally accepted principles of football:

a) running the ball usually means less chance of turnover than passing.

b) Vandy wasn’t bad, but also wasn’t as awesome as we are making him out to be (16 of 27).

c) We have 1:20 and 2 timeouts. Not the shortest amount of time, but enough to put constraints on what we can do (we’d probably have to go to the sideline at some point). Which means, we are more predictable for ISU.

d) Our QB is starting his 3rd game in his college career. Our WRs and especially our TE have shown their ability to make drops at key moments within the last half of a season.

e) Our running wasn’t as bad as people are making it out to be, considering we had 1 TD from each before OT. I’m guessing the yardage wasn’t way different, either, but maybe I’ll let you take the 15 minutes to go in and count up Iowa rushing vs passing yards before overtime started.

f) I mentioned how several teams got into shootouts on the road against BCS/AQ competition this season, and most lost them.

Finally, thanks for deciding to just say “fuck you.” I’ll make a suggestion back: learn the difference between the word “cite” and “site.”

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

Cite as in citation

you fuck hole… not site as in place… Maybe you should have stayed in school a tad longer…

And one last time. You play what’s in front of you… but keep ignoring that the Offense scored 3 of it’s last 4 possessions and that the defense gave up 3 70+ yard drives (sorry not using your source since you don’t seem to know the difference between cite and site).

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 3:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, but you weren't even

using the word “cite” correctly.

But yes, just call people names.

By the way, how old are you? I’m trying to remember if you are the childish kid or if that was someone else (maybe Gookin or Mr. Grizz?)

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

How did I use it incorrectly?

And how would site, as in place be correct?

And once again, don’t answer the questions, just misdirect and stay in your defensive posture…

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 4:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, I think you meant

“citation”, but were typing cite. And both our citations were websites, hence site.

I really didn’t mean to piss you off. I am being rather defensive because I’ve really grown tired of the constant “Ferentz-bashing” around here, and I’ve had just enough people back me on that idea that I can’t just assume I’m imagining it.

I feel like I’ve often tried to answer your questions. At this point, about all I can do is tell you to have a good evening and a nice week.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

And one last shot across the bow

since my brats aren’t done yet….

You used ‘cite’ yourself in comments on this thread… yet somehow I was using it incorrectly…

And you never addressed why you would choose OT when your Offense has scored 3 times in its last 4 possessions…

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 4:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think I used "cite" until you did.

To be honest, I’m not sure I would choose OT over going for a score at the end of regulation.

But, it is possibly understandable why you might if you have an inexperienced QB, you have a WR and TE who have drops, a RB that has possible fumble issues, and you know you will probably have to throw (and probably to the sideline at some point) to make it to FG range. And, across the field, you have a QB who threw 3 picks last week.

Because of those reasons, I thought it was slightly understandable to re-group, to let guys catch their breath, and to play OT. Again, maybe not what I’d do, but not exactly what I’d call cowardly, idiotic, or a nut-punch.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sorry...

but in our conversation you used it first. You attacked first. And until now didn’t even offer up a defense.

And really, you do not think it’s an insult to the Offense that scored on 3 of the last 4 drives be given a chance to win the game? You don’t think that Vandy might think that coach doesn’t believe in him? Yet I’m irrational thinking that could be the case… take care…

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 5:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Who cares

Just argue about KF’s horrible decision making.

by mikjones24 on Sep 11, 2011 4:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Wish I was a kid again

but I certainly hope I got over childish about 30 years ago.

BTW, this got way out of hand.

FOUR. THREE. COVER. TWO.

by Mr. Grizz on Sep 11, 2011 9:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

Um, yeah

when even Grixxly won’t go along with your defense of the coaches, Chazz, you might be way out on a limb all by yourself.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, he's angry today.

You don’t see me calling people “fuck holes” and whatnot.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not angry

I just call it like I see it. I’m actually enjoying today and grilling instead of painting myself in a corner with no defense…

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oh Jesus

I can’t even begin to…..

It’s just so easy to…

the word “cite”….

ugggh…..

Brooks Was Here.

by GreatBarrierReiff on Sep 12, 2011 3:26 AM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

http://youtu.be/P6McKZDtHdc


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 12, 2011 7:32 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yes

It’s risky. But it’s a risk you take. When we settled for OT I (along with the entire fanbase aside from you apparently) knew we were proper fucked. Our last offensive drive had the ISU defense on their heels and we could’ve went for the throat. Instead, we allowed them to hang around and they bit us in the ass. All Paul Rhoads ever wanted to do was to keep ISU in the game. The longer he kept them in the game the greater our odds of fucking up.

by mikjones24 on Sep 11, 2011 4:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

The longer he kept them in the game the greater our odds of fucking up.

That’s kind of how I felt about ISU.

I was disappointed he didn’t do much at the end of regulation. But I didn’t think we were super-fucked. The nice thing about OT is each team gets the ball, and I wasn’t doubting our ability to get TDs more often than not. I was doubting that ISU could keep up their “excellence,” because even though our defense looked bad at times, I know there are some good players that could make a difference (Prater, maybe Hyde, Binns, Daniels, and maybe Kirksey or Morris).

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well you are the only person who thinks that

Which is unbelievable but not worth arguing about because you hold the belief that Kirk Ferentz is infallible. When you’re getting beaten up all day and have a chance to make an escape you can’t play the the tie. We were trending down throughout the entire game and the loss appeared inevitable.

You (along with Kirk) were banking on ISU not being able to keep up their success. That was foolish because we were barely having any success ourselves.

by mikjones24 on Sep 11, 2011 4:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't call KF infallible.

And I accept criticism (particularly polite criticism) of him.

I’m just not a big fan of calling him a coward or an idiot, because he’ll probably end up as Iowa’s winningest coach.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's a weird way to look at things

That because he’s a good coach and could end up being our “best” coach elevates him above criticism when he makes a massive fuck up. Yesterday, he made a massive fuck up. He’s not an idiot but he certainly was a coward in that situation.

This isn’t even monday morning quarterbacking because every Iowa fan knew that it was a piss poor choice at the time.

Kirk philosophy seems to be: we just want to make your worst WORSE than our worst. But what happens when the other team doesn’t have any “worst?”

by mikjones24 on Sep 11, 2011 5:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

Even Ferentz admitted he was "hopeful" his defense would make the stand after the FG

and his comment was not convincing. I think afterward even he knew he did that middling thing that gets you nowhere.

http://thegazette.com/2011/09/10/saturday-video-blank-stares-muted-anger/

Go to the 2:40 mark where he says, “I was confident we’d get a stop” and then quickly corrects that with, “well I was hopeful we’d get a stop.”

"I wish you luck with a capital 'F'" - The Real Elvis.

by StoopsMyAss on Sep 11, 2011 5:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

Whatever.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 13, 2011 5:36 AM CDT up reply actions  

And what about a QB in his second start?

Rhoads showed more confidence in his TO-prone QB than Ferentz did with his QB. They won. They were very happy about that.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 12, 2011 1:45 AM CDT up reply actions  

Did we turn it over to them?

There was virtually no downside and the best chance we had of winning on the upside.

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 2:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

We were a point behind, so we were forced to do so, right?

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

Was it tied?

If not, then your point is irrelevant.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 2:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

You have basically turned a tie game

into a “must move ball now” situation with your comments. And I am comparing it to another situation where we had to move the ball to win. Not irrelevant at all.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

THISSSSSSSSSSSS

Excuse me for my bellicosity. And spelling. Bellicosity and spelling.

"George Teague doesn't give a shit what down it is. He gets the ball, or he dies." ~ Spencer Hall

by Blackheartnopants on Sep 11, 2011 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Or, to put it another way

If he goes for it, Kirk is telling the team “I BELIEVE in this offense and VDB. And even if it doesn’t work, we still have OT where I know we can win.” This approach demonstrates faith in the whole team, on both sides of the ball. Instead, we got Ferentz pretty much telling the offense that he has no confidence in them while at the same time asking an already tired defense to take on another herculean task.

As mentioned elsewhere on here, go for it and there is a small chance the team fucks up and turns it over, giving ISU the win. But there is a (slightly) better chance we do do enough to win and AT WORST, the most likely outcome – nothing happens – put’s us in the exact same spot. This is as close as any coach will ever get to having free money to play with in a game situation. It’s telling that Ferentz still ran away from the table.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 7:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's fine.

If, someday, we are winging the ball and we have a pick-six or a fumble return or something else, it will be interesting to hear if KF gets harangued again.

Which brings me to a slightly interesting point that I should have broached earlier. At least, with the way KF did this, he can take the blame from fans and media. A young QB, or some receivers with the slight dropsies, or a RB with 3 fumbles in two games, doesn’t have to take a bunch of crap all week about a turnover (but they also don’t get glory from a game-winning drive).

It reminds me slightly of my sophomore year of high school football (I was not much of a player, but I was suited up). We were 8-0, and playing Oelwein (also 8-0). We were at home. Whoever wins gets the “district championship” (because tenth graders don’t have playoffs).

We didn’t have a very good kicker, but we had a decent big RB. (In fact, I think that RB may have also been the kicker, IIRC). We had been going for 2 all year. Of course, we find ourselves down by 1 late in the 4th quarter, and the coach decides to kick an XP. We missed it, we lost the game.

Coach told us that the blame was on him, we should have gone for two just like all year. I’m betting KF probably told his players that this one is on him, and to rest up and get ready for next week knowing that they have the talent to win games like this.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 11:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

That is what any good coach should do in a time like this...

It is just like we a guy gets thrown out at home, the 3rd base coach owns it.

Please don't tell me how you hate BSU or their turf...I know all too well and keep my toliet water blue for a reason.

by BoiseHawk on Sep 11, 2011 11:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't doubt that's what happened after the game.

The problem a lot of us are taking up is this; how many times is a coach, even a successful, winning coach, allowed to use this line to his players, but continue to approach the game in the exact same way?

Yes, our teams are talented and have the ability to win games, even in down years, but when will Kirk turn the mirror on himself and his coaching staff as opposed to showing it to his kids?

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 11, 2011 11:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not sure.

Honestly, I think the uber-conservative decisions ended up snowballing on him yesterday.

On tonight’s “Iowa football with KF” show, he said that they wanted to try to move the ball at the end of regulation, but that the short run and then the penalty kind of changed their mind(s). This may be complete hindsight bullshit, or may be honest.

I’m hopeful that the staff will make some adjustments during the year or after. But, with so many young players, I’m not sure it is wise to change your philosophy (unless injuries force you to). To me, there is not a massive difference between 8 wins and 6 wins, as long as we make a bowl. And if we somehow miss a bowl, then we should be developing the hell out of the young guys for future purposes, anyway.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 12:38 AM CDT up reply actions  

I hope that's the case

Because I really believe that it is, in actuality, on him. Or, at least, the lion’s share of the responsibility of it is.

And Chazz, this

If, someday, we are winging the ball and we have a pick-six or a fumble return or something else, it will be interesting to hear if KF gets harangued again.
is a red herring. Once again, it all comes down to the situation. Just because something is the proper or the right call in one situation, it doesn’t follow that it always is, or vice versa. VDB didn’t have an all-star game Saturday to be sure, but he was playing better at the time. And the only players with the dropsies seem to have been the TEs (at least until Davis in OT). But dropped balls weren’t the problem.

I’ll go even further, there was a way to be conservative yet still try to win the game Saturday. Try this: Iowa lines up in a 3 WR (or 4), shotgun set with Coker in the backfield on first down. To ISU, it would look like Iowa is going to try and go for it. We then run a draw play to Coker (think Arizona 2009 with ARob). Maybe it gets stuffed; if so, we’re no worse off and can run out the clock. But maybe he busts off 15-20 yards and all of a sudden we’re in a much better spot to try to attack down field with plenty of time left. It is as close to no-risk, all reward as you can possibly get. Instead, Iowa lined up in a 2 WR I-formation. Which was simply throwing in the towel (because no one is biting on play-action on that one).

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 12:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

Well if that someday ever comes,

than any haranguing directed at KF will depend on the situation at hand – just like with this past Saturday.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 12, 2011 7:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

If you sit on the ball, you're guaranteeing that nothing good will happen.

If you go for the win, sure, something bad MIGHT happen, but the chances are better that something good will happen. And the most probable thing of all is that nothing good nor bad happens.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 1:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

Add to that some of the intangibles....

We’re playing a rival in their stadium
We’ve played a pretty poor game already
They’ve played an unusually good game (for them) already
Our defense, in particular, has stunk
We have a hot kicker
We seem to be tiring

I would absolutely want to end this game AS SOON AS POSSIBLE for all of the above reasons: any prolongation of it is likely to end badly given the pattern of the day that had developed. OT is not a tabula rasa—it’s probably going to be a continuation of what’s already gone before.

Which it did. Our offense eventually sputtered, there’s was unstoppable. As soon as we went to OT, I fully expected us to lose.

"Apparently, riding Joe Paterno like a small horse is FROWNED UPON IN THIS ESTABLISHMENT!"

by The Director on Sep 11, 2011 1:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

You forgot:

you are playing a team that didn’t make a bowl game last year.

they have plenty of young players.

they are probably also tiring.

And why say “Ferentz, you don’t believe in the offense if you kick it or run it”, but then we blame him for NOT realizing his defense is a bunch of incompetent fuck-tards?

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

SO FUCKING WHAT???

And Iowa won 11 games in 2002. That has no fucking bearing on what happened yesterday, so I’m not using that as evidence. I don’t care if ISU won zero games last year, they (and we) aren’t the same team they were. No team in college football ever is. You stubbornly cling to some sort of past history/evidence as if that has an impact on the outcome, when it doesn’t. All that matters is how the teams were playing in the game yesterday. And ALL the evidence available pointed unquestionably to the conclusions The Director lists.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 4:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, if Vegas can use it,

why can’t I? Or why can’t a coach?

I guess we are at the point where we can only analyze what happened in the last three offensive series, because nothing else matters?

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

No

But you have this myopic view that the only information that can, nay should, be used is the fact that ISU looked bad versus UNI last week. Which is irrelevant because it is completely divorced from what was happening Saturday. Now you’re dragging in the fact that ISU didn’t go to a bowl last year is somehow proof positive that they had a high probability of losing this game. In the game that was actually played, the trend lines did not favor Iowa the longer that game went on, in fact, the exact opposite.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 7:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

If you think a team's recent performance

(the week before) should never factor into decision making, then I can’t agree.

And the “didn’t make a bowl last year” is more an indicator of the overall quality of the opposing team. I’ll admit it probably doesn’t factor into decisions, but it does reflect what kind of team you’re playing, particularly early in the year.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 11:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think it should factor in

but it isn’t determinative. And after 4 quarters of play, what happened last week, last month or last year matters far, far less than what’s happened that day

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 12:55 AM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

Let's put it this way

With 90 seconds to go, which do you have more faith in?

(1) The Iowa defense — which hasn’t stopped the opposing offense from getting into scoring position since the second quarter and just conceded first downs on 3rd & 16 and 3rd & 20 — stopping Iowa State on a short field in a circumstance where they have to play back-to-back series, or

(2) The Iowa offense — which had been relatively effective in the second half once we decided to stop bleeding the clock off — not turning it over and getting 45 yards with 2 timeouts and clock stops on first downs, and Mike Meyer — who already made a 50 yarder — kicking a field goal, with the only downside being a possible turnover leading to another field goal attempt by ISU’s clearly deficient kickers?

Kirk Ferentz chose (1), and that’s so clearly the wrong choice that it begs the question of whether the man was even paying attention to the game.

Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.

by Patrick Vint on Sep 11, 2011 1:38 PM CDT reply actions   2 recs

Well put.

There was a great thread last year where some of us discussed KF’s mind-set at length, and the interesting phenomenon of people who otherwise are bright making almost delusionally-dumb decisions. KF choosing JC over Stanzi is one example, perhaps his inability to go for the win
(on multiple occasions) yesterday is another.

Once is happenstance, twice is coincidence, three times is a pattern. I think we’re seeing a pattern here. I don’t know that logic can explain it. Maybe I’m nuts, but sometimes KF seems to ignore the obvious and go by some inner voice no one else is likely to hear.

The human mind. Fascinating and unknowable.

"Apparently, riding Joe Paterno like a small horse is FROWNED UPON IN THIS ESTABLISHMENT!"

by The Director on Sep 11, 2011 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

And as I've been saying, a fumble recovery or INT does little if it's not followed by pts.

I theorize, and would love for someone to show me wrong, that even in general, an offense that goes for it scores more often than the defensive team does. But that the MOST PROBABLE thing is that the offense sputters out, the kicker misses the field goal or the defensive team gets a fumble recovery or INT and either sits on it or doesn’t score themselves… i.e. leaving them in the same position as if they’d just sat on it.

I guess that 2/3rds the time when a team goes for it, neither team scores. Rougly 25% the offenisive team scores. That in the other 8-10% of the time, the defensive team not only gets the turnover but scores off of it. So basically, 90% of the time, nothing “bad” happens.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 11, 2011 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

Our offense was plenty effective while running. I don’t have a problem with Vandy, but between him and the one throw by McNutt, we were “only” 16 for 29.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

The irony in KF's logic to make only a half-hearted effort to get a handful of yards with that running play

and then decided whether or not to make a serious effort at trying to get in FG range is this:

If he was truly concerned with making a mistake and handing the ball to ISU there then the subtext of that decision is, “I don’t think my defense can stop these guys.”

What I don’t think you realize Chad is that Kirk’s resistance to trying to win the game in regulation was a byproduct of believing Iowa was incapable of going out and winning that game from that moment forward. He believed, more likely, that ISU had to gift it to us.

This has been a tactic he’s made a living off of for many years. “I’ll let them shot themselves in the foot,” is how he thinks. But, in the spread era, the odds have turned against him. The numbers are clear.

"I wish you luck with a capital 'F'" - The Real Elvis.

by StoopsMyAss on Sep 11, 2011 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

No tactic is foolproof but some tactics are foolish.

"I wish you luck with a capital 'F'" - The Real Elvis.

by StoopsMyAss on Sep 11, 2011 2:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

I still believe in ISU's ability to give a game away.

I fear our defense may have played that badly yesterday.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

That is the ultimate testiment to one's confidence in his job security

not even Saban feels like that.

"I wish you luck with a capital 'F'" - The Real Elvis.

by StoopsMyAss on Sep 11, 2011 3:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

The first ISU drive of the day was the epitome of the defense's and the team's philsophy.

Bend but don’t break. Be conservative. Don’t try anything to risky. let the other team make the mistake at some point. Except when you have young kids prone to mistakes yourself, or your athletes aren’t that great, it doesn’t work.

meh

by tyger1147 on Sep 12, 2011 1:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

THISSSSSSSSSS

Excuse me for my bellicosity. And spelling. Bellicosity and spelling.

"George Teague doesn't give a shit what down it is. He gets the ball, or he dies." ~ Spencer Hall

by Blackheartnopants on Sep 11, 2011 4:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think this might be the perfect distillation of the issue at hand

Nothing more really needs to be said.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 9:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

Can we get a new poll?

I’d like to see a poll with the following:

Question: When Iowa decided to play for OT you went:

A) WTF!?!?! Well we’ve lost now…
B) Wow… Smart move…

I’m going to guess B would get one vote…

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 2:09 PM CDT reply actions  

My response was quieter

 . . . . .. . . . . . . . . . . ,.-‘". . . . . . . . . .``~.,
. . . . . . . .. . . . . .,.-". . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ."-.,
. . . . .. . . . . . ..,/. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ":,
. . . . . . . .. .,?. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .\,
. . . . . . . . . /. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ,}
. . . . . . . . ./. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ,:`^`.}
. . . . . . . ./. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ,:". . . ./
. . . . . . .?. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . :`. . . ./
. . . . . . . /
.(. . ."~-,. . . . . . . . . . . . . . ,:`. . . .. ./
. . . . . . /(
. . "~,. . . .."~,. . . . . . . . . .,:`. . . . /
. . . .. .{..
$;. . ."=,. . . ."-,. . . ,.-~-,}, .~"; /. .. .}
. . .. . .((. . .*~
. . . ."=-.. . .";,,./`. . /" . . . ./. .. ../
. . . .. . .

Can we get a new poll?

I’d like to see a poll with the following:

Question: When Iowa decided to play for OT you went:

A) WTF!?!?! Well we’ve lost now…
B) Wow… Smart move…

I’m going to guess B would get one vote…

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 2:09 PM CDT reply actions  

~,. . .."~.,. . . . . . . . . ..`. . .}. . . . . . ../
. . . . . .(. ..`=-,,. . . .`. . . . . . . . . . . ..(. . . ;
,,-"
. . . . . ../.`~,. . ..`-.. . . . . . . . . . . . . . ..\. . /\
. . . . . .
Can we get a new poll?

I’d like to see a poll with the following:

Question: When Iowa decided to play for OT you went:

A) WTF!?!?! Well we’ve lost now…
B) Wow… Smart move…

I’m going to guess B would get one vote…

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 2:09 PM CDT reply actions  

~.*-,. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ..|,./…..\,_
,,
. . . . . }.>-.\. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|. . . . . . ..`=~-,
. .. `=~-,
\. . . `\,. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .\
. . . . . . . . . .`=~-,,.\,. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .\
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . `:,, . . . . . . . . . . . . . `\. . . . . . ..
_
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .`=-,. . . . . . . . . .,%`>—

I can ride my bike with no handlebars...

by hkobb7 on Sep 11, 2011 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Impressive.

What is it?

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

It's either a dick, Marge Simpson, or the space worm from Empire Strikes Back.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think I see all three, and I'm terrible at Magic Eye posters.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Facepalm

The University of Iowa: the best 6 years of my life. My parents are very proud.

by HawkeyeGirleye on Sep 11, 2011 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

I can't see it either.

It’s all… broken up by Grixxly’s post (twice). Weird.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

I can't see it either, now

It was fine when it was first posted but when I went to OTE and came back my post showed up twice and it was hacked in half…

by Grixxly on Sep 11, 2011 3:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, hypothetically, if you did see it the first time, what did it look like?

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

It's a bald guy doing a facepalm!

The University of Iowa: the best 6 years of my life. My parents are very proud.

by HawkeyeGirleye on Sep 11, 2011 3:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

I see it now.

I think I liked Bucket’s possibilities, better.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

sure

but none of those were likely to be his reaction to OT ;)

Also, now that I’ve exited this thread & returned, Grixxly’s post is now in the middle of it. Glad I got to see it before that happened.

The University of Iowa: the best 6 years of my life. My parents are very proud.

by HawkeyeGirleye on Sep 11, 2011 4:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ahhhh! It's Piccard!

Now I see it.
 
Neat!


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 4:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well that makes it even cooler

Wouldn’t’ve figured that part out without help, that’s for sure.

The University of Iowa: the best 6 years of my life. My parents are very proud.

by HawkeyeGirleye on Sep 11, 2011 4:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

If I could frame this comment and hang it in a museum, I would.

It might be the most dada thing that’s ever appeared on BHGP.

AND THAT IS SAYING A WHOLE HELL OF A LOT.

"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"

by RossWB on Sep 11, 2011 5:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Intensity/Emotion

This is one aspect of KF that really bothers me. I think it’s become abundantly clear that when it comes to in-game emotion or pumping the team up, Ferentz just isn’t going to do it and it falls entirely on the players to do so. When we had a Mitch King, that’s great and it works, but if we don’t, we can’t look to the coach to provide some fire, it’s just not in his nature. And that is a glaring failure. I’m not looking for Mike Stoops or Bill Lynch, because that is too often more harm than good, but there are times when some yelling/jumping up and down from the coach is completely necessary. These are, after all, still boys or young men they naturally look to their leader when times get tough. Unfortunately, their leader is too often a statue.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:03 PM CDT reply actions   1 recs

A couple of them try

But this is an issue of a failure of leadership. The passion has to come from the top down so that it is seen to be a spur to the entire team, rather than individual units.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

Really?

We’re having this discussion again, where if Kirk isn’t a cheerleader or on crack during the game then he’s not a leader?

"So, the caterpillar has emerged from its cocoon as a shark, with a gun for a mouth" - M. Burns

by rupertj on Sep 11, 2011 4:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

It's not an either/or proposition

And you and Chazz need to get off this one-trick pony rhetorical device.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 7:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Then what do you want out of him?

What public actions would make you believe that he cares?

"So, the caterpillar has emerged from its cocoon as a shark, with a gun for a mouth" - M. Burns

by rupertj on Sep 11, 2011 8:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

To be honest, I'm not sure

I’ve said that before. And it’s not that I don’t think Ferentz cares, I’m sure that he does (maybe not as much about some games as I do, but that’s an insignificant quibble). But he needs to inspire at times, and he seems unwilling to ever do so. I’ve had a lot of coaches in my life, some were terrible, some were great, most were just ok. The truly great ones knew when to be nurturing, when to be confrontational, when to yell, when to speak calmly. What bothers me about KF is that it appears he doesn’t believe there is ever a point during the competition when it’s ok to get a little fired up, to let his players know that passion is part of the game. Most of the time, his calm demeanor is an asset, but there are times when he just needs to yell and get his guys fired up so that they play with passion.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 8:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ferentz's demeanor is not an issue for me anymore

it used to be but I don’t think contemporary football responds to that anymore. The world is overstimulated. I never had caffeine as a college student. Now they all are drinking red bulls for breakfast. A coach cannot compete with that and need only let it flourish on its own, which I think all coaches do.

Ferentz’s bigger problem is sensing and managing ebb and flow of football games. That is a difference maker in coaching. The best at doing that (I’ve ever seen) was Joe Gibbs. At the college level the hands down best right now is Chris Peterson. That dude is amazing the way he pushes buttons in a game and it ALWAYS works. He makes Ferentz look like blind man in a room full of deaf people.

"I wish you luck with a capital 'F'" - The Real Elvis.

by StoopsMyAss on Sep 11, 2011 8:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe you're right

and, at this point, it is what it is with Ferentz.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 8:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

I laugh that

when maybe KF does get worked up about something on the team, like anything regarding DJK, he’s a complete dick.

But he’s also an ass because he doesn’t yell enough during key moments.

I bet we’d be surprised at how little Hayden yelled at his players during a game or in the locker room or whatever. Even if they did do the Hokey Pokey.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 11:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

Nobody ever called KF a dick for yelling at DJK.

I won’t bother explaining the difference because that’s not a conversation that’s worth rehashing.

by The Mexican't on Sep 12, 2011 8:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

I disagree.

I think there were posts around here making fun of KF for telling DJK to “dress properly” for time with the media.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 13, 2011 5:38 AM CDT up reply actions  

Now you're just inventing

boogey-men to inveigh against.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 13, 2011 9:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe I can agree with this, Hoya and Bucket.

Still, I like KF’s quiet happiness after a win, compared to Rhoads’s weepy histrionics.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 3:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, so do I

but I’d like to get the fucking win first

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 3:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

Frankly, I like both.


"Oh, glorious cheeseburger, we bow to thee. The secrets of the Universe are between the buns."

by Bucketochicken on Sep 11, 2011 4:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well and when we do get a firey type player, they'd better be on defense

Because its obvious Kirk does not like his offensive players to show off at all. But its OK if you’re on defense.

Again, he’s showing the NFL mentality.

"u r awesome" ~ my daughter

by The Bird Cult on Sep 11, 2011 7:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

Honestly, I think some of that is

that offensive players probably tend to get penalized more for over-celebration than defensive players do.

And I do usually see KF and other coaches giving encouragement to players, particularly offensive and special teams players, as they come off the field after a series or a kick return or whatever.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 11:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

When they handed the ball to Coker to start the last drive in regulation, I almost got up and walked out of the bar

After remembering that I still had to pay my tab, I sat back down and decided to stick through OT. Kirk’s decision left such a bad taste in my mouth, I didn’t even care who won, I just wanted the game to be over.

Well, isn't what LeBron did last night the living embodiment of The Secret, leaving millions on the table and turning himself into a hometown villain, all for the sake of winning?
Neil Paine, basketball-reference.com

by snley on Sep 11, 2011 3:07 PM CDT reply actions   1 recs

I did the same thing.

As soon as the game went to OT, I went to a HS game that I’d been missing. There was no question at that instant that Iowa was going to lose, and that KF threw the game with his absolutely mindless decision. There was no reason to watch it first-hand.

by Nyghtewynd on Sep 11, 2011 3:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

This is as depressing as it is enlightening.

That is all.

"I hope we're not looking past Alabama to Temple the next Saturday." - Jack Ham

by ReadingRambler on Sep 11, 2011 3:30 PM CDT reply actions  

The Defense has major issues

but they arent new either. Last year had a common theme. the offense would score and give us the lead/tie. there would be 5 minutes or less, and the Defense would allow a late Score with a minute left, leaving the Offense to score again. Missouri was literally one bad call and one bad pass away from doing the same thing to us again.

in 2009 Stanzi was magic and scored in those situations. in 2010 he was human and he didnt, and in 2011 Ferentz apparently didnt even want to give Vandy a chance to come back, but it doesnt change the fact that the Defense yet again collapsed late.

i hate to say it, but this may be on Norm. this is becoming a multi year trend. I love the guy, i think he is one of the greatest defensive coaches around, but between this and his health issues it may be time for a retirement after this year.

"Your spelling and grammar errors belie a seriously skilled thought process"- therealCatnuts

by justsomehawkeyefan on Sep 11, 2011 3:59 PM CDT reply actions  

Yes.

The old guy just can’t get it done anymore.

Bye, Norm.

/super-sarcasm

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe not

can you explain why our defense has constantly failed in those situations then?

"Your spelling and grammar errors belie a seriously skilled thought process"- therealCatnuts

by justsomehawkeyefan on Sep 11, 2011 4:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

Defensive players getting tired?

Other teams having competent offenses (or at least getting their shit together late in a game).

And, yes, our predictability certainly has a role, as well.

Our coaching deserves some of the blame. Just not all the blame, IMO.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

How much substituting did we do

on the D line? Or overall on the D. I’m asking, I don’t know, but I don’t think it was much. This either means that the coaching staff is backing away from their earlier comments about having more rotation this year, or, and this is what scares me, the guys we saw are not just the best players we have, but are so obviously the best players we have that we can’t even risk putting the other guys on the field, i.e., that they are still worse than exhausted 1st stringers.
Either option is scary.

"'Contrariwise,' continued Tweedledee, 'If it was so, it might be; and if it were so, it would be; as it isn't, it ain't. That's logic." - Lewis Caroll, Alice Through the Looking Glass

by chitownhawkeye on Sep 11, 2011 5:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

Someone here said we were rotating some.

I’ll re-watch the game later this week and try to post or comment on here about it.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 6:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

I know we rotated a bit

Forgy, Nardo, Bigach, and Davis were all in there at various times. As for how much each, though, I have no idea.

"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe

by Brock8144 on Sep 11, 2011 6:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

If our defense cant stop competent offenses....

then thats on the D coordinator in my mind. If our players are getting tired via being out of shape, thats also partially the D coordinator’s problem. those are things that norm is supposed to be keeping track of at least partially

like i said, i like norm, but a trend is a trend and unless someone can think of another reason that wouldnt at least be partially his doing for this, its on his head.

"Your spelling and grammar errors belie a seriously skilled thought process"- therealCatnuts

by justsomehawkeyefan on Sep 11, 2011 6:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'd say we mostly stopped a more than competent Wisc offense last year

Stopped them enough to win.

I refuse to defend the special teams play after that stop though.

Please don't tell me how you hate BSU or their turf...I know all too well and keep my toliet water blue for a reason.

by BoiseHawk on Sep 11, 2011 7:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

Defense looked good against

PSU, MSU, Mizzou, Tenn Tech.

And while they didn’t look good late against jNW or OSU, I’m not sure we can say they looked truly bad. They did look kinda shitty against Minnesota. I tend to blame the offense for last year’s IU near-miss.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 11:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

The defense against Mizzou

gave up almost 400 passing yards. We were fortunate in that game.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 12:57 AM CDT up reply actions  

Wasn't Mizzou a good offensive team?

And the game was in Arizona. You have to add about 100 to 150 yards to each phase of the game for every opponent that Iowa plays in that state.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 1:07 AM CDT up reply actions  

That's ridiculous

and I hope you’re just joking.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 1:09 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'm joking with the yardage comment.

But going into the Insight, I knew Mizzou had a decent-to-good QB and a fleet of fast WRs.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 1:10 AM CDT up reply actions  

Iowa's defense did not play well against Mizzou.

One pick-six does not equal a good defensive performance.

by The Mexican't on Sep 12, 2011 8:57 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yes

Me as well

"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe

by Brock8144 on Sep 11, 2011 4:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

So while reveling in the Bears decisive and wonderful victory...

Papa Grigs brought up a very good point;

“Riddle me this… how many of Iowa’s 2010 starting defensive linemen are playing football today.”
“Three, dad.”
“I rest my case… no wonder we have been rusty and inexperienced-looking.”

He’s making a really solid point. We’re much, much greener than people are realizing.

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 11, 2011 4:15 PM CDT reply actions  

Somewhat true.

But, Binns and Daniels have a decent amount of experience. It seems like there have been many years where we’ve had to replace a couple DLs at a time (King/Kroul, Mattison/Iwebema, and more I can’t think of at the moment).

Our LBs need to grow up fast. Kirksey may be doing so, but we may need Morris to become more of a playmaker rather than “just” a competent player.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 4:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Binns was a backup and Daniels was a semi-starter.

And neither were on the level of Ballard/Clayborn/Klug in terms of consistency. Again, he’s pointing out exactly what I’ve been saying… this is a transitional year, in multiple areas on our team.

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 11, 2011 4:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm kind of surprised Kirksey is getting so many votes.

He was easily the best defensive player out there yesterday, but I also think I remember him getting beat in coverage a couple times and letting Jantz slip away from him on an ISU touchdown.

Keenan Davis impressed me the most. Consistently caught the ball, slipped tackles, generally made the best of the 5 yard routes they made him run most of the day. He had a drop near the end of the game, but Iowa scored anyway so I guess I don’t really care.

I really don’t like playing for overtime. I didn’t like it against Ohio State two years ago either, but I understood it more then. Vandenberg had not been throwing down the field well, but you don’t have to throw it very far with that much time and two timeouts. Keenan Davis was hot, McNutt is McNutt. You have to at least trust JVB to… aaahhh. Can’t talk about it anymore. I’m going to try to enjoy NFL football so my brain doesn’t hurt too much.

by fugeeu on Sep 11, 2011 4:25 PM CDT reply actions  

The drop by Davis was before the FG

so yes we scored, but ultimately led to the loss.
That said, its really just me nitpicking, as I too was very impressed with his play the rest of the day.

"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe

by Brock8144 on Sep 11, 2011 4:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I couldn't remember if it was before a FG or TD.

None of the players in the poll were perfect though. All of them had at least one key mistake. I guess that’s just the only one I remember Davis making and it didn’t seem so bad.

I really didn’t want to vote for the kicker.

by fugeeu on Sep 11, 2011 4:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

That drop was the reason I didn't vote Davis

and as a fellow CR Wash alum, I really, really REALLY wanted to. But the fact remains you have to make plays at the most important times and Davis dropped a definite first down and a possible TD (had a block, like his chances of making people miss and getting in). So Davis dropped down to a 1(a) situation for me.

Please don’t think I’m not really impressed by his play yesterday. I am. This is truly a case of nit-picking.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 7:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

1995

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 8:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well before me (2006)

but I’m sure we have mutual acquaintances.

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 11, 2011 9:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

I hope not

because, outside of teachers, if I were sharing acquaintances with your classmates, I think Chris Hanson might invite me into the kitchen for a cookie.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 9:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

I mean to say

I probably know people you went to school with, not the other way around. And yes, you’re right, Chris Hanson would be all over that shit.

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 11, 2011 10:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Lord Kirk Stark

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 11, 2011 4:29 PM CDT reply actions   1 recs

We pay Kirk Ferentz a lot of money

To make smart decisions and win football games. It isn’t really important to me what happens to our players after they live the University, I care about what they do while at the University. So the whole Kirk Ferentz/NFL players thing doesn’t matter to me. Nor does his old school approach or “aw shucks” mentality. I just wonder how long it is before he realizes his ultra-conservative approach doesn’t work against a coach/team that plays with nothing to lose.

by mikjones24 on Sep 11, 2011 4:57 PM CDT reply actions  

I appreciate your honesty.

Because it is a college football team, don’t we also want KF and staff preparing the boys (at least somewhat) for life after college? They won’t all be NFL players, but it would be nice if they all can find jobs and become relatively productive citizens.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 5:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's not what I'm saying

I’m glad he does it but I don’t care about it. I could just give a shit less about people using it as one of his positives when has plenty of negatives on the actual football field.

by mikjones24 on Sep 11, 2011 5:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Seriously, dude.

It isn’t as easy to win these games as it looks.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 5:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

And there it is.

It took a little while, about 10 hours, but there it is.

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." - Teddy Roosevelt

by HawKCP on Sep 11, 2011 8:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

We're in the middle of a friction' semi-depression

I think it is totally reasonable for the Iowa fan base and boosters to ask themselves if someone else could do the job better for 3 1/2 million.

I honestly believe we should NEVER EVER EVER lose to Iowa State. I think we need to adopt the Aztec philosophy on all of our games – if we lose, we are going to be scarified to the gods.

Kirk does not play to win, which is why he has such a shitty record in close games. That has been clearly established. The question isn’t whether he should be fired – because I don’t think he should be today. But are we getting value for our dollar? Part of the valuation, in my mind, might be to consider staff changes that get coaches that have better game management skills in there to help Kirk. Norm’s health is a cloud that’s hanging over this team right now, IMHO, and its clearly still impacting the defense. I think its more sensible to start thinking about a new DC for next year now, and there’s no reason to not encourage KOK to start looking for his head coaching gig. There are plenty of successful assistants out there that would probably LOVE to come to Iowa and prove that they can a) develop talent and b) manage game flow at the same time.

I think we have the talent to compete; we just need to take the next step in managing flow, and often the toughest part of change is looking in the mirror and honestly accessing yourself. Other coaches don’t seem to have a problem firing assistants or helping them gracefully exit. For 3 1/2 million a year, if the boosters say JUMP Kirk should not be debating the species of frog with them, he shouldn’t bounce the second time until he hits the Gulf of Mexico.

"u r awesome" ~ my daughter

by The Bird Cult on Sep 11, 2011 10:56 PM CDT up reply actions   2 recs

There are plenty of successful assistants out there that would probably LOVE to come to Iowa and prove that they can a) develop talent and b) manage game flow at the same time.

Name one or two.

And, the more important question is how many were willing to do so in 1999.

I’m not sure KF is worth 3.5 million, but he has that pay grade because of tenure and success (big ten titles, bowl wins, great attendance at Kinnick).

Look at some other Big Ten programs that brought in coaches recently: how do you like the idea of a Jerry Kill or a Ron Zook or a Luke Fickell or a Mark Dantonio or a Bill Lynch or a Rich Rodriguez or a Brady Hoke in black and gold? To me, I’m not sure any of them would do better at Iowa than KF has done.

I’m withholding judgment yet on Kevin Wilson, because I think he might be able to improve things at IU. I suppose I should probably give Jerry Kill and Brady Hoke more time too.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

Here's the thing...

it’s not necessarily about doing better. And you’ve already pointed this out yourself… Kirk is likely gonna retire as Iowa’s winningest coach. There’s no question that he’s successful, in far more ways than just winning.

The issue is that it seems like he’s lost touch with what the one true goal is; win the football game. Put your team in the best position to win, and everything else will follow with it… he’s already proven this and his programs strengths are so entrenched that making the W the top priority is not going to bastardize anything. As SMA said earlier, Hoke showed yesterday that he trusts his kids and their ability to win when he gives them the reigns. When was the last time you can say Kirk did as great of a job with that as Hoke did yesterday?

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 12, 2011 12:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

Did Hoke do a great job yesterday?

Or did his team just struggle to beat a very over-rated ND team?

I think it may be a mix of both.

And I think KF may have done something like “handing the kids the reigns” in the Insight Bowl (it is late, and I’m not recalling every detail from that game).

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 12:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

That wasn't meant as a rhetorical question, by the way.

He’s done it on many occasions, but also failed to do it on several. I should’ve framed my comment a little better the reflect how I feel. There are times when Kirk plays it so close to the vest that you wonder if he thinks he’s playing a video game where he’s reached a check point and can try it again if he fails his first few times around.

I think Hoke has done terrific thus far. I’m separating him from the team mind you… the way he’s coached has impressed me. But, I agree.. a mixture of both in terms of the game itself.

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 12, 2011 12:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

He certainly didn't do it in the Insight Bowl

But he didn’t turtle-shell it like he did yesterday. The key to the Insight Bowl was that Ferentz and Iowa were playing within themselves: we weren’t busting out exotics and trying to overdo it, we stuck to what was working and tried to fix/adjust what wasn’t

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 1:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think we've "busted out exotics"

all that often.

Did we try more than the one (the McNutt pass) against ISU?

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 1:11 AM CDT up reply actions  

I meant "exotics"

in the getting away from ourselves/what type of team we were. We were amazingly steady in that game, even with Stanzi having an off night (think we missed DJK much? I know, I know there is no possible way he could have played). But the coaches were also willing to take chances/change things up, especially on defense. It had mixed results, but it showed a recognition that sticking slavishly to the script wasn’t going to work and different wrinkles were needed to win the game.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 1:14 AM CDT up reply actions  

That ND team isn't overrated

over 1000 yards of offense in 2 games should tell you that. That is a very competent ND team, and one that Michigan was very lucky to beat. They were not the better team Saturday night.

"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe

by Brock8144 on Sep 12, 2011 9:32 AM CDT up reply actions  

So USF is really good?

Honestly, I’m not sure how good ND is, but they’ve looked kinda crappy two weeks in a row against programs that aren’t exactly top-caliber.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 13, 2011 5:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

9 turnovers

7 inside the opponents’ 15 yard line. Yes, they are good.

"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe

by Brock8144 on Sep 13, 2011 9:14 AM CDT up reply actions  

TANGENT ALERT!!!

I think Kill is the right answer for Minnesota if this were five years ago (or whenever Brew was hired). I really think he is a great coach for the team, but his health is too shaky for him to have a long-term impact which is what Minny needs at this point (i.e. their version of Fry/Alvarez). I think Wilson is gone the second a better spot is offered to him and I’m not buying Hoke right now, he strikes me as nothing more than a heavier version of Kiffin.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 1:05 AM CDT up reply actions  

It will be really, really interesting to see what Hoke and Borges do with The Denard now.

He looked absolutely useless in their “hybrid” power offense — until they threw out their playbook and begged him to save them. His passing has regressed, he can’t see anybody downfield, and if he is doing any reads, it’s not apparent.

At some point Denard has to decide if he wants to make money in the NFL, or be a crappy D-IAA quarterback. He’s not playing the right position. Can you imagine that guy having 25 touches a game, in partnership with a real quarterback?

We play tackle football.

by Bellanca on Sep 12, 2011 8:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

Big Kill fan here.

The guy is so intense and physically vulnerable, however, he does have a good probability of dying on the sideline. Perhaps college football isn’t that important.

We play tackle football.

by Bellanca on Sep 12, 2011 8:09 AM CDT up reply actions  

So what?

I don’t agree with him, but Bird Cult has been amazingly consistent on his beliefs in regards to this. He’s not trying to sneak the idea in, as you imply, merely stating his beliefs. The fact that you’re unwilling to debate the merits (or lack thereof) of Bird’s position and try to dismiss it offhand says more about you than him.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 8:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

Calm down Sparky.

I’m merely pointing out the fact that Ferentz’s job was just called for in this thread. These threads pop up after every loss and it seems like those who are on the warpath always claim that no one is name calling or calling for Ferentz’s job.

I’ve had this conversation on here before and I’m sure I’ll have it again. For now, I’m content just watching from a distance.

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." - Teddy Roosevelt

by HawKCP on Sep 11, 2011 8:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

I just read it again

and I guess he’s not outright calling for Ferentz’s job but it’s not far from that.

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." - Teddy Roosevelt

by HawKCP on Sep 11, 2011 8:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not, but I think we could do better - but does the Iowa fan base and the boosters want to TAKE the chance?

Its whether we are willing to TAKE THE RISK and what I’m suggesting is, in many ways, Ferentz mirrors a lot of the Iowa fan base, which is still scared to death that we’ll go back to 20 years of losing seasons “if we don’t keep Kirk!”

After it was obvious Fry was done, I think the fan base was convinced that Stoops was going to the HC… without rehashing that whole debacle, in retrospect, I think they picked the safest choice that was available.

I think there’s a lot of the fan base – maybe not a majority, but a a sizable percentage – that believes that if Stoops was our HC we would have seriously sniffed and be sniffed at regularly the MNC right now… because Stoops isn’t afraid to take chances and he is the kind of a prick with killer instincts that is out to win college football games and championships, not necessarily to develop players for the NFL or be a nice guy.

I think what’s driving most of the fan base crazy is Kirk is good enough – the staff he’s assembled – at developing talent that we are on, actually, a higher level than we were under Fry. Kirk has won some big bowl games and, despite the fact that these close losses fucking SUCK, under Hayden we seemed to either win big, or get fucking blown out. Part of that, I’m sure, is due to the fact that Hayden would gamble offensively to a much greater extent than KF ever will.

But we can’t seem to make that next step to being a real MNC contender year in and year out. I think we can legitimately say that under Kirk that we are a good program and that in some ways, he is Joe Pa West… that’s not necessarily a bad thing to be. He doesn’t have a MNC like Joe Pa, but Paterno got his during a time that I would argue its easier to do than it is now because there’s just so much goddamned innovation in college football, there’s definitely a more equitable distribution of talent across the conferences and name teams… a decade or two ago, people weren’t innovating to the extent that they do now, and I agree with SMA that offense and the spread is the future. You kill people with passing and points now and mobility.

Our team is built like Penn State’s. Solid fundamentals. Nothing fancy. Minimize mistakes. Play the percentages. The problem is, that brand of football works far better if everyone else is trying to do the same thing and you’re just a lot better at it than everyone else.

Michigan was a lot like this under Bo… they didn’t have that many plays or variations, they just came out, lined up, and out-talented and executed you. So how do you overcome that? You introduce the element of crazy-ass playground basketball to football, and if you’re not a good game day coach staff, the improvisation will drive you batshit crazy and you won’t able to adapt.

But my point is this – if this trend continues we are going to find less and less success against spread teams and mobile QBs and our vanilla offense is going to end up ultimately fucking us because we can’t score enough points to keep our defense off of the field. And I don’t think the Iowa fan base is going to put up with 7-5 or 6-6 teams with MAYBE an 8-10 win season 2x a decade anymore. They’ve tasted too much success now and to get to that regular 8-9 win years, Kirk is going to have to change. Or lose his job. 3.5 million is way too much money for mediocrity that results as a refusal to change and adapt and to look honestly in the mirror and say “We’ve got to do something better to manage game flow.”

The problems we have right now are almost entirely the staff’s inability to manage games… because that inability fucking magnifies the mistakes and misfires that we make on offense and defense in a supposedly mistake-adverse scheme.

The question that is really on the table here is whether we really, down deep in our hearts, want to change horses. I’m not suggesting we run Kirk out of town based on the ISU game – but I think we need a coach that has a greater passion for winning and willingness to take risks. But is the Iowa fan base willing to take the risk and push for change?

And don’t think that we can’t get it changed. They got rid of the Cy-Hawk trophy, and if enough people bitch and moan loud enough something will change, even in an athletic department with its head so far up its ass as far as the media and internet pressure goes as Iowa is.

Kirk is a nice guy… maybe, they sure haven’t handled some of the player problems and rhabo scandal and some other stuff very well. Part of that is a totally fucked SID and SI process. But studies have consistently shown that nice guys earn less in the workplace, and I suggest that ALSO applies to success in sports. Belicheck would probably boil his granny in a turkey fryer in the basement if it would help him win games and win another Superbowl…

"u r awesome" ~ my daughter

by The Bird Cult on Sep 11, 2011 10:38 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

I agree with a ton of what you're saying.

About people bitching and fans/boosters/media making an issue of the obvious problems; it would help so, so, so much if the media weren’t so afraid or weren’t so complacently respectful of the team and athletic department. If they actually asked the questions that everyone that doesn’t have a seat in the press room wants to hear answered and put the coaching staff’s feet to the fire, I wonder what would come of it. I was so disgusted yesterday when KF came on the post game radio show and Dolph and Eddie just complacently listened to Kirk recite the same old lines, just minutes after they had been lamenting about all the glaringly obvious problems that this game displayed. I get it, the media likes Kirk and he really is a great coach that runs his program in a pretty wholesome and constructive way. But why does that mean that he’s given a hall pass every time shit is going south? If your child is a 4.0 student and rarely makes mistakes, aren’t you still entitled to get angry when he/she does?

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 11, 2011 11:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

The question that is really on the table here is whether we really, down deep in our hearts, want to change horses. I’m not suggesting we run Kirk out of town based on the ISU game – but I think we need a coach that has a greater passion for winning and willingness to take risks. But is the Iowa fan base willing to take the risk and push for change?

KF just got our only BCS win about 21 months ago. We started 9-0 that year. But yes, let’s get rid of him, because he doesn’t have that passion for winning. (sarcasm)

He has won three straight bowl games. Ask other Big Ten coaches how easy that is.

Bob Stoops isn’t afraid to take chances, but he also doesn’t have the greatest record in the biggest games. And nobody really even knows if he seriously considered coming to Iowa, so why keep bringing it up?

Finally, why don’t we ask Nebraska fans (Solich), or ISU fans (McCarney), or Michigan fans (Carr), or Minnesota fans (Mason), or many others what happens when you run a “nice” guy who wins, but doesn’t quite win enough?

Can you come up with many examples of programs who were slightly better than .500, and consistently making bowl games, and fired their coach, and got better? I’m having trouble making a list. Maybe Florida when they went from Zook to Meyer. Maybe Auburn when they went from Tuberville to Chizik (but I’d prefer we not also have to have the Devil sign our next coach’s contract).

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 11:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ok, I see where you're coming from every time...

but do you see what a lot of us (like TBC and I) are getting at? At all? Cause it doesn’t seem like it.

It’s ok to question, Chazz. Seriously. It’s ok to be mad and flip-flop on this issue about Ferentz. Because even though he is a winning coach and wins us bowl games and puts guys in the NFL and yadda yadda yadda… he also has shortcomings. And quite a few of them. And right now, it’s seeming as though his shortcomings are far outweighing his successes and strengths heading forward. Time is linear, not elastic and forgiving. KF’s resume and his strengths will always be there, but why are you seeming to leave out the possibility that his shortcomings are beginning to grow?

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 12, 2011 12:11 AM CDT up reply actions  

…he also has shortcomings. And quite a few of them. And right now, it’s seeming as though his shortcomings are far outweighing his successes and strengths heading forward. Time is linear, not elastic and forgiving.

Everyone has shortcomings. Nick Saban is an asshole. Les Miles eats grass clippings. Mack Brown kills hookers (Hook ’Em Horns!) Jim Tressel is a liar.

Yes, I’m exaggerating. I’m just not as irritated by KF’s shortcomings as many people around here. Some call this blindness, but it is college football, and I already have enough stress in my life.

I’m not completely sure his shortcomings are growing. If the game is really changing, then he needs to adjust. But I’m not proclaiming that based on the ISU game, or on 2010’s disappointments.

And, in college football, I think time is a bit elastic and forgiving. If KF uses the last few years of his Iowa career to go out on a high note and win a Rose Bowl and another conference title or two, how many people will remember that he lost to Western Michigan?

In college football, you tend to be judged by your last two or three games. If we are .500 going into mid-November, and we beat Nebraska and make a bowl game, plenty of people will be forgiving.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 12:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

I will certainly be one of them forgiving.

But I’ve actually been all over this issue since at least the jNW game last year. It’s a refusal to change the system and adapt to what’s in front of you that is becoming a really frustrating trend with this coaching staff and team. Guys like Edds and Greenway, and lines like the one we had in 09 and last year… they don’t grow on trees. By all means, run our really awesome and old-school system when you have the personnel to do so… but when you don’t? Why not change it up to win the football game? That’s what I’m so perplexed about. And it goes for stuff on offense as well.

I’m not willing to debate the point I made about time being forgiving though. Yes, Kirk will always be known as one of the best Iowa coaches, but if the current trends continue, he’ll also be known as a coach who lost touch. Notice that I’m not saying they will continue… just if they ido, his later career seasons won’t be remembered as fondly as his earlier seasons. And I will always remember that we lost to Western Michigan, just like many, many other people will.

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 12, 2011 1:01 AM CDT up reply actions  

How big a sample size do you need?

If you look at Iowa under Ferentz in the first 6 years versus the next 6 years, 2009 was the outlier of the second set. yet you point to it as if it were the norm and seasons like 2010 are the hiccups.

Does that mean Ferentz should be fired? No, but we’re well past the point where it is even a question of whether the game is changing (it has) and whether KF needs to adapt (he does). To think otherwise is, quite simply, nothing but willful blindness to reality.

What those changes ought to be, however, is still up for debate and won’t pose easy answers. But right now, Ferentz seemingly doesn’t even acknowledge that the game has changed, he’s static in a fluid world.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 1:21 AM CDT up reply actions  

It's no worse

than others trying to use the opinions of one poster to paint everyone with whom they disagree with the same brush. On any forum such as this, blanket statements such as “no one” or “everyone” are impossible, the opinions are much too varied. It’s just the opposite side of the coin of you and Chazz insisting that any time there is a loss, “everyone” starts calling for Ferentz’s head.

Like I said, Bird has been consistent and vocal about his opinion in re Ferentz’s job security and the reasons for that (see above and below these posts). And that’s fine. It’s at least a debate (premature in my opinion), but you seek to dismiss it out of hand because, apparently, you don’t want to bother to make a counter-argument. Which, again, is perfectly fine. But if you’re not willing to discuss the merits, it might be better off to just not say anything at all.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 8:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'll determine when and what I want to post. Thank you very much.

I’m not dismissing it. I’m merely pointing out it’s presence. Furthermore, I applaud TBC for making the comment, at least he’s got the stones to come out and say it directly (for the most part). It’s the passive-aggressive bunch who I suspect would like to see Ferentz gone yet aren’t willing to say it who really annoy me.

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." - Teddy Roosevelt

by HawKCP on Sep 11, 2011 8:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

That standard you employ

“I’ll determine when and what I want to post” seems to be a one-way street. You have every right to do so, it would be nice if you seemingly extend the same courtesy to others. But your belief that the place is crawling with enemies within belies the idea that you’re willing to have a give-and-take. Put it this way, you can’t simultaneously take the high road while slinging mud.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 8:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

I won't presume to speak for anyone else

but what’s getting to me is the “bad” losses to lesser teams. They are happening far too frequently while we have fewer and fewer wins against what I would consider teams that are just better than us. And I’m not just talking about this year and last, I mean since the start of the 2005 season. In all that time, since the start of 2005, I can only point to two examples where Iowa beat a team that I think was just flat-out better than them: Illinois in 2007 and Penn State in 2008 (possibly MSU last year, though I really don’t think they were that good or we that bad). Unfortunately, I can point to far more examples of us losing to teams that had no business being in the game with us at all and I’m not talking about teams roughly equal with us, I mean just inferior teams.

There will always be times when you lose to a lesser team, it’s just the nature of the game. That’s fine. But what’s troubling is how often it has been happening and that didn’t use to be the case.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 8:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

How many "bad" losses are you seeing?

Just for one point of view, I just pulled up CFN’s 5 year ranking, and Iowa has the most “Elite” wins over that time, and a below average number of “bad” losses (2).

"So, the caterpillar has emerged from its cocoon as a shark, with a gun for a mouth" - M. Burns

by rupertj on Sep 11, 2011 9:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

Your mileage may vary

As this is a completely subjective view. But, here are the losses to “bad”/clearly inferior teams (I apologize if my meaning wasn’t clear above, I can see how it could be read different ways) to talent Iowa was fielding.

2005: jNW, ISU
2006: jNW, Indiana, Minnesota
2007: W. Michigan, ISU, maybe Indiana (this one is close to being equal)
2008: Illinois possibly jNW
2009: none, though jNW is close (other factors at play in this one)
2010: Minnesota, and, let’s face it, Indiana (should have been a loss, but wasn’t miraculously).

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 9:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

I have a difficult time

accepting only 2 “bad” losses.
Then again, I think CFNs criteria don’t capture everything, I get what they’re trying to do though. But that’s a separate issue. I’m way too lazy to look this up, but if somebody is ambitious, what is our record vs teams that we’re favored by more than one score?
At the end of the day, I’m tired of losing to Northwestern.

"'Contrariwise,' continued Tweedledee, 'If it was so, it might be; and if it were so, it would be; as it isn't, it ain't. That's logic." - Lewis Caroll, Alice Through the Looking Glass

by chitownhawkeye on Sep 11, 2011 9:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah - we had NO business beating Penn State in 2008

That was the game that broke the trend of close losses – at least for a while… and it was fun ride while it lasted. I’ve watched the DVD of that game a zillion times and I still don’t know HTF we won that game. Penn State was clearly better than us… we just did to them what ISU did to us yesterday – we outplayed them and wanted the game ultimately worse than they did.

"u r awesome" ~ my daughter

by The Bird Cult on Sep 11, 2011 11:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

…while we have fewer and fewer wins against what I would consider teams that are just better than us.

I think a huge part of this is a function of us being at the top of the “second tier” of the Big Ten. The only teams that are consistently better than us are OSU, and maybe Wisky. And we do beat Wisky a decent amount of the time. Our struggles against OSU continue, but 40 or 50 years is a “hell of a drug.”

I’d say we do OK in bowls against equal or “better” opponents. We beat a GT team (were they higher ranked in the BCS going in?) We have split a couple bowls with Florida. We beat LSU. We lost to Texas. We lost to USC. We beat Mizzou.

It is too late (just after midnight, Iowa time) for me to coherently post about our successes/failures against PSU or MSU.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 12:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

And I too, am not happy when we lose

to IU or Indiana or Purdue. But shit happens, and this isn’t our fathers’ NW program. And Purdue occasionally does hit a high point on their roller coaster, too.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 12:14 AM CDT up reply actions  

Once or twice is annoying

consistently doing so, as we have, is a fundamental problem. And your answer that “shit happens” ignores the reality that it has been happening far more often recently (see 2001-2004, we might not always beat our peers or the teams clearly better than us, but we never fucking lost to teams that were clearly inferior).

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 1:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

You can continue on all you'd like.

I’ll say this and be done with it.

I’m not telling anyone not to post something, in fact, I commended the man for making a bold statement when so few are willing to do the same, despite my suspicions that they’re thinking it.

The rest of your post, I don’t even understand nor do I care to have it explained. You seem to be looking to pick a fight and I’m not going to give it to you, this time.

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." - Teddy Roosevelt

by HawKCP on Sep 11, 2011 8:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes,

because this


And there it is.

It took a little while, about 10 hours, but there it is.just screams respect for a different opinion. You did express your belief that it was commendable that TBC was being bold, but only after I called you out on it. So pardon me if I’m not overwhelmed by your sense of largesse.

As for the rest, I find your drive-by accusations more than bit distasteful, but not as much as your complete unwillingness to back them up when challenged. Lord knows Chazz and I rarely see eye-to-eye, but I can at least respect the fact that he will get in and explain/defend his position rather than just lobbing rhetorical grenades around. With Chazz, it’s a discussion – heated at times to be sure, and often unnecessarily – rather than simply a shotgun blast as you slink out the door.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 9:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm going to take that as a complement.

And I’ll return fire: you are almost always fun to converse with, too, Hoya.

I don’t begrudge disagreement. And you don’t either.

By the way, Serena Williams completely bitched out an official (maybe the same one as a year or two ago) again today. I’m glad Serena lost.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 12:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

Thanks

It was meant as a compliment (or at least as a segue to one that I never quite completed).

I often find your positions simplistic/fatalistic and mind-numbingly stubborn – and I’m sure you feel similarly about me often times – and I’ve certainly gone off on you more than you deserve from time to time, but I have always and continue to respect the fact that you are willing to get in and debate and defend your thoughts/opinions. I might not often agree with your philosophy/outlook, but I respect your steadfastness in articulating it. To put it another way, “say what you will about the tenets of National Socialism, at least it’s an ethos…”

As for Serena, eh, I can’t really give a shit one way or another. I’ll admit that I was kind of glad she lost, but that is due more towards my dislike of her (and her sister’s) attitude towards the game. When they want to be, the Williams sisters are so clearly light-years better than the rest of the field that it is absurd, they are practically unstoppable; the problem is that they only seem to give a shit 3 weeks or so out of the year.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 1:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

Thanks

For the props LOL – I guess. I’ve never been a big KF – he has turned out decently, I was on the Stoops bandwagon like everyone else and when the announcement was made I went “WTF is this guy?”

The reason I think we could do even better now is hey, its a decent paying job, the fan base is relatively patient and not terribly rabid and unreasonable, and we’ve rewarded continuity at Iowa – only two coaches since 1979. That’s 32 fucking years, an geologic era in coaching terms (Joe Pa lives in his own universe tho LOL).

I think Kirk has built the program to a much more solid footing than it was under Hayden. What we need now is someone who can take that foundation AND manage game flow. As SMA has pointed out, there really aren’t all that many guys available who are super kick ass at game management… but if you can get a guy to Boise, you sure as fuck can get them to Iowa and a conference where if you can dominate people WILL take you quite seriously.

Thanks to Hoya for pointing the underachieving. You know, I would be MUCH happier with Kirk if we lost to teams we SHOULD lose to. Its losing to teams that are clearly less talented that to me is a firing offense. And there’s enough of a trend there, if I were Barta, I would be getting out the thumbscrews and applying them, and if Kirk bolts for the NFL, so be it… we will get someone good and we will not descend into disaster as so many Iowa fans fear. The job is simply too attractive now, I believe, for it to descend into Shitville. We are a completely different fan base, with completely different (and reasonable) expectations compared to places like Michigan and ND.

"u r awesome" ~ my daughter

by The Bird Cult on Sep 11, 2011 10:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

…the fan base is relatively patient and not terribly rabid and unreasonable, and we’ve rewarded continuity at Iowa – only two coaches since 1979.

Except that, some of us want to fire the guy that is one of those “two coaches since 1979” and is one of two (of the three winningest Iowa football coaches) to win a BCS bowl.

And how long would we keep this reputation as a reasonable fanbase, if our AD is “applying thumbscrews” to a widely respected coach like KF? How long do we keep our rep when we continue to be unsatisfied with winning records, bowl wins, and decent starting QBs?

I know I’ve been sniping at you a bit tonight, Bird Cult, but I’m not sure you realize the shitstorm it requires to fire a guy like KF. We would be lambasted by many media outlets and many fans (a silent majority, if you will, hur hur) would be pissed if we showed him the door without a couple of seasons’ worth of losing records.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 12:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

Oh, please come off it, Chazz.

Those who actually want Ferentz fired are such a radical minority that they are almost instantly ignored for their chicken little tone. I think so many of us are angry/frustrated because we want KF as our coach but continuously see him undermine his own legacy with stubbornness.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 12, 2011 2:41 AM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Rec'd for the last sentence

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

I can get on board with the last part

"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe

by Brock8144 on Sep 12, 2011 9:38 AM CDT up reply actions  

I think what bothers me,

is that the pattern of losses in close games gets “is on” the coaches. Meanwhile, other things (sorry, DJK) get dismissed pretty easily.

Iowa basketball has earned a bit of a rep as a “coach-killer.” I don’t want Iowa football to do the same, in the name of making/winning more BCS bowls that may not even happen.

After every loss, people start talking about “accountability” and “questionable decision-making.” I think it is fine to criticize decision-making, but we are fans and I don’t think Gary Barta runs the staff hiring by us. I’m not a fan of name-calling.

I’m not sure how many coaches out there really are so much greater in either regard (in-game decisions, taking responsibility). Stoops mentioned Chris Peterson. Obviously, Saban has had success. I don’t much like the idea of a riverboat gambler like Les Miles in Iowa City, but I guess he does have some success. Urban Meyer is not walking through that door, and if he does, he’ll have chest pains.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 12:07 AM CDT up reply actions  

IMHO, he is paid way too damn much to do anything BUT win football games

Yes, I know we have a relatively clean program (I’m sure we have plenty of issues besides just what ends up seeing the light of day – just like everyone else).

But this guy is paid way too much to pull the shit he did yesterday – and we Iowa fans, for whatever reason, have such an inferiority complex we are a) afraid to question (or at least the powers that be are) and b) and “if we question, he might leave, who will we get to coach us that’s as good as Kirk?”

I would suggest that if he left for the NFL this year we’d get somebody as good – probably somebody even better.

"u r awesome" ~ my daughter

by The Bird Cult on Sep 11, 2011 7:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

I would suggest that if he left for the NFL this year we’d get somebody as good – probably somebody even better.

Again, I’m sorry to be an ass, but can you at least speculatively throw out some names you have in mind?

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 12:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

What I think is most telling here

is that at least two decisions that are normally very debatable, going for 2 vs taking an XP, and taking a knee to go to OT vs trying to score, are extremely 1 sided here.
Under normal circumstances with KF’s teams in the past, either of those decisions may have divided the crowd here. Today, they are both extremely one sided. These are tough game decisions, and virtually all of us believe that he made both of them wrong. If we’re this certain, what does the team think? It’s been mentioned frequently here, but if KF is saying multiple times a game that he doesn’t trust his offense, what is that going to do to their confidence long term? Next week is going to be very interesting.

"'Contrariwise,' continued Tweedledee, 'If it was so, it might be; and if it were so, it would be; as it isn't, it ain't. That's logic." - Lewis Caroll, Alice Through the Looking Glass

by chitownhawkeye on Sep 11, 2011 5:48 PM CDT reply actions  

I know we've all been wondering:

Where is the lost member of Dougie Fresh’s City Boyz?

Your answer: on youtube, of course.

http://deadspin.com/5838997/m+bish-who-smokes-that-kush-totally-calls-his-fellow-tenth-graders-out-as-tools-dirty-rags

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 11, 2011 6:04 PM CDT reply actions  

And now for something completely different...

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 8:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

It's been a bad weekend for my teams

Miami will presumably get destroyed tomorrow night and my fantasy team is getting absolutely fucksawed. About the only thing going right is my glass of Templeton.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 9:00 PM CDT reply actions  

Where did you find that in VA?

I lived in Templeton for a couple years and don’t have a bottle…

Damn you super sperm!

by Feelin' Orney on Sep 11, 2011 9:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

Got it while I was back home two weeks ago

Part of my birthday present from my sister (keep in mind my birthday is in May, and she was just getting it to me when I flew across country)

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 9:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

Dolphins fan?

Kick ass, I’m not alone

"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe

by Brock8144 on Sep 11, 2011 9:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

The few. The proud.

The perennially disappointed.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 9:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

I have a friend who is a Phins fan.

I’ll be going to a bar and grill with him tomorrow night to watch.

I need Ochocinco and Gostkowski to have huge games if I’m even going to compete in my fantasy matchup this week (I needed the same from Shonn Greene and Santonio Holmes tonight, but I don’t think they did enough for me).

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 12:28 AM CDT up reply actions  

Sac State got crushed

OTOH, the Evil Harbaugh’s debut with the 49ners went well. They’ve finally got a coach that’s sufficiently arrogant enough (a la Walsh and Seifert) to win. The 49ners are the kind of franchise that needs an arrogant coach, because the whole Bay area is amazingly uptight and condescending despite its hippy/liberal reputation. New Yorkers are MUCH nicer people.

"u r awesome" ~ my daughter

by The Bird Cult on Sep 11, 2011 11:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

As a Niners fan,

and Pete-Carroll-hater, I was quite happy to see the Niners actually thrive in a fourth quarter today. Of course, I don’t think we can or should depend on two kick/punt returns for TDs from Ginn every game. And, the Seahawks may be quite shitty, as they are starting Tarvaris Jackson.

Still, regarding the NFL, I’m on cloud (forty)nine for a week.

We will become more intensity!!! --What Reading Rambler thinks Tom Brands should do.

by WaterlooChazz on Sep 12, 2011 12:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

I can't even get mad anymore...

I had my days. When I watched KF flip flop Stanzi and JC6 in the Pitt game where Stanzi was clearly the better quarterback, I called for heads after that loss. I screamed at the TV while working at a bar when the end around was called in the last drive of the Alamo Bowl against Texas. I swore obscenities that scared my kids when KF played for OT against tOSU. I was a miserable bastard for most of the fall of 2010.

Yesterday, I had to watch the game from ESPN updates on my cell phone, and I was walking around the concourse at the NASCAR race in Richmond staring at my phone and hitting update every couple seconds. After ISU tied it with 1:17 to go, I told my buddy. He said, “well at least you have the ball with some time.” My reply – “Kirk is going to run out the clock and play for overtime.” He didn’t believe me, until I told him run for 2 yards, run for 4 yards. In the 3rd OT, I said it was 4th and 1 and KF would kick the FG and rely on the defense to go to a 4th OT, but that ISU would score. After it happened, I put the phone down and just went about having fun the rest of the day, not really dwelling on the utter stupidity that had just happened other than some tweets about this year feeling like 2007 all over again.

I certainly don’t say any of this because I think I’m some great prognosticator or brilliant – only because it has gotten so fucking predictable. Until there is some sort of change, we will always get moderate success from Iowa, being close in every game but somehow losing to teams that Iowa should not lose to and once in a while winning a big one.

I am not calling for the coaching staff to be fired. That would just be stupid, like Iowa State-McCarney stupid. But there needs to be some change – scheme, coordinators, personnel, whatever. Until then, I will simply face the rest of this season, and the rest of the KF era, with a feeling of meh.

Damn you super sperm!

by Feelin' Orney on Sep 11, 2011 9:01 PM CDT reply actions   1 recs

You live in Richmond?

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Virginia Beach

We make the trip for the fall race every year.

Damn you super sperm!

by Feelin' Orney on Sep 11, 2011 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Gotcha

Thought you might be amongst the small group of us in Richmond. Which reminds me, saw someone in the parking lot at the grocery store today with a large tiger hawk in his back windshield.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 11, 2011 9:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

No large tiger hawks for us

Just Hawk shirts and hats for me and the wife. When we were making the turn to walk up in the grandstands, a guy stopped us and said “I fucking love the Hawkeyes!” I am guessing he had spent the entire day drinking and didn’t know what happened yet.

Damn you super sperm!

by Feelin' Orney on Sep 11, 2011 9:14 PM CDT reply actions  

KF has adopted batshit insanity as a philosophy to win football games.

I’m sorry, but doing nothing at the end of regulation was plain stupid.

//digression
There are better reasons for not going for the 4th and 1 in OT and other conservative moves.

But when:
1. In regulation time, you have possession of the ball, and a field goal wins the game!!!!
2. Have timeouts, plus clock stoppage at first down
3. A defensive plan which had not worked all game (only saving grace was blatant early mistakes by Iowa St.)
4. Talent superiority at WR over defensive opponents
5. O line thats been providing decent pass protection
6. All against a team that is less athletically talented

We might not have scored, but we were tied and OT was the default. Vandy could get sacked, so what? We still had OT! He could throw the ball into the bench a couple times (if there were no open receivers), so what? We still had OT!

This decision wasn’t cowardly… it was something else. It was patently absurd in a college football game.

For most players, their college team is the highest level they will play. Most will never play at the pro level. I remember watching an interview with J. Hunter last season. There was no “next level” for him (and most players in college ball).

KF might find recruiting harder, and sold out stadiums less common if he continues to treat genuine games as if they are simply practices open to the public.
Games are competitions…

If it’s not worth trying to win, we shouldn’t play at all. Injuries,pain and sacrifice by the players are all in vain, if the coaches take the ability to win out of the hands of the players.
  

by iowabeakster on Sep 11, 2011 11:33 PM CDT reply actions  

Jordan Bernstine?

Does anyone know where Jordan Bernstine was during the game? And more importantly why he wasn’t in to help us?

by Wayms on Sep 12, 2011 12:08 AM CDT reply actions  

He was sick.

Strep throat.

Templeton Rye'd the Lightning.

by Smokin Herb Grigsby on Sep 12, 2011 12:12 AM CDT up reply actions  

One thing that hasn't been really discussed

today, recently or even in the past except in glancing mentions, is how much player attrition this team has had over the last few years. As a result, we are incredibly thin (and young) at a number of positions. It was shocking to me that despite having a noticeable limp all game, Nielsen was never subbed for. This complete lack of depth at LB is worrisome given his history and surprising since the past few recruiting classes seem to have had 5003 TEs and LBs in them. After the starters, we seem to have nothing but freshmen and sophomores to back them up, and not enough of them as it is. How the fuck did this happen?

And despite being young on the defensive line, we’re still rather thin there, especially after this year when we lose Binns, Daniels and Daniel. We’re going to be counting on an awful lot of RS freshmen and sophomores next year, which could mean the horror continues as the result of inevitable growing pains. I don’t know that there is “blame” to parceled out here, but it does raise some questions and legitimate concerns about our player retention

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Sep 12, 2011 2:01 AM CDT reply actions  

Holy shit.

I go to work at 3PM and get back about 2AM-ish and find this place has gone up for grabs. I’m just going to keep drinking this delicious Three Floyds beer (thanks, BOC!) and take it all in.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Sep 12, 2011 2:35 AM CDT reply actions  

What a Pussy!

Ferentz is a pussy that has never thought about winning a National Title. He’s a tenured professor.

z

by What the CLUCK? on Sep 12, 2011 10:40 PM CDT reply actions  

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