The Takeaway: Minnesota
by Adam Jacobi on Oct 31, 2011 8:30 AM CDT
in Iowa Hawkeyes Football
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Sure, Iowa just lost to Minnesota, 22-21. But how much do we really know? What was so important about losing to Minnesota? What does it all mean, Basil? The Takeaway has the answer.
Minnesota has the pig for two straight years, for the first time since a three-year stretch from 1998-2000. Well, you know, that's certainly not what this team wanted, and we're going to have to look at our game preparation and see what we're not doing right. But that's Big Ten football, you know, and you can't dwell on results in the past, you just have to get back up and stick to your gameplan and just be ready to out-execute the next team in front of you.
Seriously, Minnesota lost to New Mexico State and North Dakota. No question, we wanted to get this win, and we thought we had the game plan in place to do it. But hats off to Minnesota, Jerry Kill's a great guy, and they just executed better down the stretch and found a way to get the win. That's just football.
This is a team that either isn't talented enough or can't be motivated to prepare enough to beat Minnesota. Well, I think the most important thing is that we just keep this game in perspective. It's just football. And you know, to get all bent out of shape about a football game, I don't think it suits us very well. We're going to address the problems we saw there on Saturday, and there was a few, no question, but we're not going to go overboard and lose our heads over just one game.
After the first half, Marcus Coker looked like he was legitimately ready to break the Iowa single-game record for rushing yards. He didn't even come close, and Iowa tried instead to put the ball in the hands of Jason White and Jordan Cotton on the last drive. I don't think this is a team that's focused on stats, I think that's a bad way to manage a ballclub, and once you start setting quotas, you know, you're coaching to the stats and not to the win. No question, we did a great job of getting Coker loose in that first half, we saw a lot of good things from him there,
We just had to deal with Minnesota's gameplan in the second half, they did a real good job of limiting our ability to get the ball to the guys we like the most, and that led to some really quick drives which is what we wanted to avoid. And, y'lnow, we'll evaluate that on a week to week basis and maybe start looking to slow the game down some more and get back in our comfort zone. Y'know, you career guys, you've been covering this team long enough, you know we're confident enough in our gameplan that we're not going to go changing things week by week.
Iowa has shown a clear disinterest in doing three things now: covering a fake punt, covering an onside kick, and covering a mobile quarterback: Both teams played hard. Both teams played hard. Both teams played hard, my man. Both teams played hard.
(Written in the style of my faaaaaavorite coach in the world, and undoubtedly your favorite coach too.)
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If it were anybody but Minnesota
This would be slightly amusing.
NOT AMUSED
Incidentally, how did you get KF to write this Takeaway?
Excuse me my good, sir...
Well, I think the most important thing is that we just keep this game in perspective. It’s just football.
I bleed and piss Hawkeye football!!! ((as I bite through a steel bar)) And this was the game that was supposed to get us into a bowl! Bowls are one of the only things we can legitimately hold over Iowa State’s head! << and I can’t stand the endless bantering that will come from my dumb ass brother-in-law on Thanksgiving and Christmas. Football gives us the POWER!!
but I digress, it just really blows. And the Catholic in me says to just forgive the football team, and pray that we’ll get a win somewhere in the next 4 games. ((huff))
and that's another Hawkeye first down... EHAWW!!
about the post being written by KF?
or about playing hard?
and that's another Hawkeye first down... EHAWW!!
Guys, it's not that sophisticated of a joke.
Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.
by Patrick Vint on Oct 31, 2011 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions
Yes it is
Some of the answers could have been from the presser.
The answer? Aliens. Or not aliens.
by Blackheartnopants on Oct 31, 2011 9:46 AM CDT up reply actions
I think you are being a little rough on the guy
It’s not like he’s become a caricature of himself or anything. Oh, wait, nevermind.
by Iowa Refugee on Oct 31, 2011 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions
Frankly I was surprised the portion in brackets was even added.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions
I knew the team wasn't great this year but I never ever thought we were this shitty.
Losing 2 years in a row to a broken team like Minnesota is beyond pathetic. It is deplorable.
No one who gets paid what he does should ever say “It’s just football.”
/makes backhand blocking gesture
/nods
/takes note
/spins fingers around
/claps
/chews gum
/goes 15-14 against ISU, jNWU, Indiana, and Minnesota since 2004
Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.
i don't understand the meaning of the spinny fingers
it seems to be a general response to whenever we get scored on or something bad happens…
Burt Reynolds is my spirit guide.
I think it's to make our players imagine pinwheels and cotton candy makers
Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.
by Patrick Vint on Oct 31, 2011 9:06 AM CDT up reply actions
/removes headset, rubs hand through hair
/searches for coach who gets paid less than half as much as him to shake hands
/goes to locker room and talks about not executing
/goes to press conference and talks about not executing
/goes home and talks about not executing
/goes to sleep and dreams about not executing
/talks about not executing for the next 6 days
/doesn’t execute next Saturday either.
/repeats process without ever understanding that it’s (mainly) not the fucking problem
This
Also…
/gets question on why he hasn’t won a road game in a year
/makes pithy comment about how the bowl game wasn’t played in Kinnick
/gets question about why his team can’t block a corner blitz
/makes pithy comment about how it was actually a safety blitz, doesn’t address fundamental point
/gets question about why it is that his team shows no drive or desire or emotion against shitty rivals
/makes pithy comment about how he’s never heard anyone say that before
Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.
by Patrick Vint on Oct 31, 2011 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions
Maybe.
If it is, it’ll be only because of Rob Howe, Mas Casa, & Hlas. I don’t really ever hear anyone else ask anything remotely close to a tough question.
In reality though, I imagine it’ll be about as epic as any other. I.e., ho-hum.
"Pursue happiness... with diligence."
by Bucketochicken on Oct 31, 2011 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions
If Kirk Ferentz
Was half as good at coaching as he is at deflecting reporters questions, Iowa football would never lose a game.
Hlas asked two tough ones.
Ferentz was contemptuous in his response.
All you need to know about that press conference was the body language when he sat down: head sinking into his shoulders in a crouch, arms folded in front. “Just try it” was all that said. He’s acting like a representative of a private corporation, and one that he owns — not a public university football program that people all over the state value and love.
Basically, it’s not necessary for him to always act like a prick just because he doesn’t enjoy talking to reporters. He certainly enjoys the banter when he wins one. This should be a two-way street, or all those Tigerhawk flags (saw two at half-mast yesterday) and decals on mailboxes, that I saw driving west from I-35 to Estherville, down through Gillette Center, all those households where people admire and follow the Iowa Hawkeyes, they’re going to start to feel used.
That’s because your average Iowa doesn’t act like a prick when he fucks up, and doesn’t respect people who do.
We play tackle football.
At this point
should we really be surprised that Ferentz seems more than willing to just use people for his own ends? It’s become a pattern, he does it with players (DJK, ARob), why should the fans and media be any different? He has many virtues, but he is not without his flaws. And this is a pretty fucking big one.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
I don't know if he uses people.
I wouldn’t go that far.
But, he’s certainly “using”, if inadvertently, the good will of Iowans. He’s certainly walking into press conferences with a predictable bucket of shit whenever the sun’s not shining just the way he would like — and given recent failures, that’s half of the time. He’s certainly failing in a basic responsibility, which is to be a gentleman when under pressure, and be helpful and forthcoming to the people who pay his salary.
I see no evidence that he sees a difference between getting paid by the Kraft family, and being paid by the people of Iowa. He acts like Belichick, but he’s not working for the same people in the same situation.
These coaches tend to have a defensive, self-pitying streak, that justifies a lot of selfishness once they become successful and stop having to move their families every 15 months. Ferentz needs to get over it. Hayden Fry was very badly used by SMU, but he got over it.
If Ferentz doesn’t want to act like someone representing a small rural state, and display the manners and humility that define success here — unless the games go his way, then he’s happy to joke around — he ought to take his Belichick/Shanahan impression to the NFL.
I don’t think he realizes he is being such a prick (“Ha-ha, that’s just my job as a coach, to get this presser over in 7:21”), and I do think he’s convinced he’s protecting his team by being contemptuous of reporters trying to understand a very public game. But he’s wrong on both counts.
We play tackle football.
by Bellanca on Oct 31, 2011 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Ehhhhh
He may be a football coach who is stuck in his ways, but he’s not a sociopath. You can’t make it as far as he has without people skills.
For me, the issue is Kirk facing the idea of showing Norm the door and learning to loosen his grip a bit on game days.
Kirk has done way too much good to have his ass kicked to the curb. That being said, things feel flat. He’s earned the right to make changes.
The answer? Aliens. Or not aliens.
by Blackheartnopants on Oct 31, 2011 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions
I may have over-spoken
because I didn’t mean to imply that I believed that Ferentz is sociopathic.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
Its cool, I'm pissed too
The answer? Aliens. Or not aliens.
by Blackheartnopants on Oct 31, 2011 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions
BUT HE'S PROBABLY DROWNED A WORM OR TWO
BASTARD I’LL BET HE"S GONE FISHING ONCE
Never *question* Bruce Dickinson!
http://www.thebirdcult.net
by The Bird Cult on Oct 31, 2011 5:14 PM CDT up reply actions
He's certainly psychopathic;
he’s craaaaaazy detached.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm with you
I don’t want to kick KF to the curb either. Only the Buckeyes have more former players on current NFL rosters, so clearly he’s doing something very right. But there has to be accountability, especially with his salary.
by Iowa Refugee on Oct 31, 2011 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't necessarily want to kick him to the curb, either
but this defense of him:
Only the Buckeyes have more former players on current NFL rosters, so clearly he’s doing something very right.is actually an indictment. We have (or have had) the talent to compete, yet outside of 2009, we haven’t. That means were squandering our talent, and that’s on the coaches.
When the fuck did we become the Clemson of the Big Ten?
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
by HoyaGoon on Oct 31, 2011 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yes, yes, yes
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions
I think it's more like we're
the Arizona Instructional League for the NFL.
My buddy and I counted maybe 2-3 guys on Minnesota who could start for Iowa. (He’s a Minnesota fan and UM prof/admin, and an ex-football player (four year starter at guard); it’s just an opinion, but it’s not an uninformed opinion). I’m sure we got our ‘developmental’ licks in Saturday, but I’d have preferred we just bury the other team, since they only have about 20 guys who could even make our travel squad.
We play tackle football.
2-3?
Who? D-linemen? I don’t know if I would take anyone talent-wise.
"Sometimes the truth gets in the way of a good story" - KF
by The Bacon Explosion on Oct 31, 2011 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions
Royston and that WR.
I now am blocked on his name, and 3 minutes of searching didn’t easily turn it up (WTH, gopher web presence?)
That's even depressing
Since Stoudemire was hurt and didn’t play on Saturday.
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 2:01 PM CDT up reply actions
No, I understand that,
but he’ll clearly be in an NFL camp. But I was playing the game, during the game (when we weren’t doing anything): exactly who on this roster would be an impact player for Iowa?
The UM guy I attended with said “One.” It wasn’t Gray.
We play tackle football.
Oh yeah, I get what you were saying
It just made it even more depressing since he wasn’t even on the field.
Did your guy say Tinsley?
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions
I think Gray would be damn good at WR
I still don’t understand why he’s under center (yes, I realize they just beat us – but he is a very bad QB).
"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe
His final two were Iowa and Minnesota
Minnesota offered to let him play QB while Iowa wanted him at WR
"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bull." - W.C. Fields
He wasn't too great of a WR last year
…but that may have been the Brewster’s FIGHT! TRY! LEARN ROUTES! Coaching…
by 99FormationsButFourWideAin'tOne on Nov 1, 2011 9:39 AM CDT up reply actions
Wasn't he their leading receiver?
"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe
It is very much an indictment
The answer? Aliens. Or not aliens.
by Blackheartnopants on Oct 31, 2011 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions
Oh, yes I fully realize that it's an indictment
thought about that as I was looking up the numbers. For those who say
“we are Iowa, we can’t get top recruits and to expect a top 10 team every year is simply not realistic”
If we have the second most NFL talent in the conference shouldn’t that affect the outcome of games?
by Iowa Refugee on Oct 31, 2011 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions
It would be interesting to see the rest of the B1G...
To see if this is just an Iowa thing, or if other programs do the same.
by One Night Stanzi on Oct 31, 2011 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions
Fuck the NFL.
I’d rather have only a couple (or zero!) players on active NFL rosters and be a college football powerhouse that regularly and consistently is a legitimate contender for both conference and national titles than have 30-whatever players in the NFL and get pantsed (AGAIN) by fucking Minnesota.
"Pursue happiness... with diligence."
by Bucketochicken on Oct 31, 2011 12:10 PM CDT up reply actions
THIS
Never *question* Bruce Dickinson!
http://www.thebirdcult.net
by The Bird Cult on Oct 31, 2011 5:15 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm not a fan of any NFL team and I don't much care for the league.
Now tell me again how, as an Iowa Hawkeye fan, I should give two shits about NFL careers of former players other than being happy for the kids?
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions
Simple, in the normal case it's predictive of college team performance.
Not always (UNC puts a lot of guys in the league) but usually.
We play tackle football.
Well this is overly harsh
When a college choice is supposed to prepare you for a career, KF’s staff has clearly done better than almost any other in preparing football players for a career in football.
I know we’re all angry but why the pointy sticks at anyone with a difference of opinion?
I spent half my life's earnings on wine, women & song. The other half I wasted.
by therealCatnuts on Oct 31, 2011 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm happy when the university prepares the kids for their lives.
I’m happy when the team representing the university wins football games. This isn’t even out of anger; you’re telling me I should care about something that, frankly, I don’t.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 12:30 PM CDT up reply actions
How about this
I like to see them do well because during every game they do the lineups and everybody says what school they go to. For that slice of fans who care about such things, I’d rather they hear “Iowa” and think “They send a bunch of good players up” than “Oh god, he’s gonna suck”.
It’s a good reflection of the program when they do well and Iowa is a team that will always be able to use as much positive reflection as it can possibly get.
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
I didn't say I don't want to see the players do well
but that it’s about the bottom of things I care about when it comes to Iowa football. Name the number of Boise State players in the pros right now. I must suck to cheer for that team.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions
They play New Mexico State, right?
Circle of life man… circle of life.
Just beat jNW.
by One_ill_KevinJ on Oct 31, 2011 11:24 PM CDT up reply actions
It's entirely possible that after playing NMSU
They’ll play Alabama or LSU for the National Championship. Laugh all you want.
Oh, and I bet they’d beat Minnesota.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Nov 1, 2011 3:20 AM CDT up reply actions
So their B.A. is in Football?
Seriously… KF has done a great job coaching up players for the next level but his title is Coach not Professor.
Other than being able to use the NFL as a recruiting tool, I too, could give two shits about how many we send there.
Yup.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions
The 40 or so players this past summer that made NFL camps.
out of the hundreds that have been through his program in that time? Preparing kids for the NFL i almost meaningless in hte point you’re making.
meh
It's not his right to make changes.
If they aren’t winning games, it’s his DUTY. He was hired to win football games after all.
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
He was hired to make money
Obviously, “winning games” and “making money” go hand in hand but you won’t see the U do anything until Iowa football starts to trends the wrong way on the balance sheet. Ferentz could be paid $10 million and turn a profit right now. Until that changes, he’s in.
Are you ready to stop going to games yet? I know lots of us are close.
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 12:29 PM CDT up reply actions
I haven't been to a game in a long time
Distance + Craptastics Eyeballs make going to games an experience that is less enjoyable than I would prefer.
But I would be very ready to stop. I watch the games to be entertained, and losing is not entertaining to me.
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
Then you should come on the road trip
because while the action on the field may be awful the show on the bus should be the very definition of entertainment.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions
basketball could be the big beneficiary
At this point I’d almost rather have BB season tickets. They’re cheaper, there are more games, it takes less time and effort to go to a game, and the team is trending in the upward direction, unlike the football team.
by StewMonkey13 on Oct 31, 2011 1:05 PM CDT via iPhone app up reply actions
Unfair and unfounded.
He doesn’t “use people for his own ends.” I love the Hawks just as much as the next guy and more than the guy or gal before me, and I HATE to lose (gahhh! damn it all!), but that’s just wrong to say such a terrible thing about KF. Criticize his coaching style, but please don’t attack his character and integrity. We’re Iowa fans, not SEC fans. Let’s keep it together and in perspective!
"I mean, are they going to poop their pants or are they going to get tough?" ~Tom Brands
by Hawkeyegirl on Oct 31, 2011 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
This might be the most damning aspect of Ferentz's coaching
goes 15-14 against ISU, jNWU, Indiana, and Minnesota since 2004
But, you know, TWO BIG TEN TITLES (shared, none in the past 7 years) and WON AN ORANGE BOWL!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So you can NEVER, EVER, EVER question the good Captain.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
It's certainly the most baffling statistic of his career,
which I think is quite good. This alone is enough to make me think that we need to go Bielema when we play in the doldrums of the B1G. I want “Herky. Smash.” and 50 point outputs.
Just beat jNW.
by One_ill_KevinJ on Oct 31, 2011 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions
Hey, this just in...
Our defense sucks. The defense has sucked from game one, hasn’t gotten any better and still sucks.
Based on the trend ( I consulted with a GA Tech grad), the defense will continue to suck for the rest of the season. Everyone should expect record yards from Denard next Sat.
by Stay thirsty, my friends. on Oct 31, 2011 9:06 AM CDT reply actions
But the defense, through 3 quarters, had allowed something like 5 first downs
Sure, the 4th quarter was a meltdown for those guys and I don’t agree that it’s a bad defense. Poor tackling, poor execution…it was a bad 15 minutes for those guys.
But the offense and special teams were the culprits again. Inability to cover an obvious onside kick (twice in two years against Minnesota), the fake punt last year, Penn State faked a field goal this year…Minnesota was giving up something like 36 points a game this year. We scored 21. Missed field goals (of course Meyer misses a 24-yarder, but their guy, attempting his first collegiate kick, nails his 28-yarder. So typical), weak play-calling in the red zone (just run the fucking ball; it was taking 3-4 defenders every play to tackle Coker)…
Just perplexing from this entire team. This should’ve been a rout. But as I said in the game thread, that’s what happens when you give a bad team some belief in a rivalry game.
Comedy is where the mind goes to tickle itself.
Granted the offense had an "off" day and a kicker will miss gimmes occasionaly.
But the defense has been consistently sub-par, piss-poor, weak, etc… (pick your adjective), since game one and hasn’t shown any marked improvement.
The coaches have to take the blame for the onside kick, guess Ferentz and Co. didn’t do their homework and they got an F- on the test.
by Stay thirsty, my friends. on Oct 31, 2011 9:36 AM CDT up reply actions
Lots of "off" days recently
The answer? Aliens. Or not aliens.
by Blackheartnopants on Oct 31, 2011 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions
For the defense, starting with the WI game last year.
by Stay thirsty, my friends. on Oct 31, 2011 10:40 AM CDT up reply actions
Maybe, but the Defense didn't lose this game.
If I told you Minnesota would score 22, I bet you would have projected a W. I would have.
Just beat jNW.
by One_ill_KevinJ on Oct 31, 2011 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions
"But the defense, through 3 quarters, had allowed something like 5 first downs"
Except for last year’s Arizona game this could be the official motto of this defense. How’s that working out for us?
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Sure, but it's more indicative that the first 3 quarters were on the offense, not the defense
They played well until Minnesota took the ball after we went up 21-10.
Comedy is where the mind goes to tickle itself.
I won't say the defense is awesome - clearly it's not
But Minnesota scored 22 points. Iowa scored 21. That’s not on the defense. If the offense were more efficient, Iowa wins this going away. 2 missed field goals, a fumble inside the 15, TO on downs on the opening drive. It’s the offense and special teams.
Comedy is where the mind goes to tickle itself.
Miami (OH), New Mexico State and North Dakota State.
Give or take a few points, Minnesota had the same production against those defenses as they did against Iowa. 21 points should be enough to beat Minnesota.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions
You really would've felt comfortable with Iowa only scoring 21 points in that game?
Comedy is where the mind goes to tickle itself.
I would be confused as to why Iowa ONLY scored 21 points
but should be fairly confident that what’s been an upper-tier B1G school for a decade could hold the worst BCS conference team in the country to below 21.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Nov 1, 2011 3:22 AM CDT up reply actions
"but we're not going to go overboard and lose our heads over just one game".
It’s just not one game. Your lead off post of the picture from the 2010 AZ game pretty much tells the story from that game to last Saturday
Private Joker, he's silly and he's ignorant, but he's got guts and guts is enough. Now you ladies carry on!
is there a breeze in here?
Darkness warshed over the Dude - darker'n a black steer's tookus on a moonless prairie night. There was no bottom.
by AcrimoniousAngerererer on Oct 31, 2011 9:29 AM CDT up reply actions
Hello, I am privatejoker and I don't get the joke
(hint: I am not actually privatejoker, and I do actually get the joke.)
"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bull." - W.C. Fields
is it me
or does it feel like every game since 2009 northwestern just feels very very VERY similar?
"Your spelling and grammar errors belie a seriously skilled thought process"- therealCatnuts
by justsomehawkeyefan on Oct 31, 2011 9:19 AM CDT reply actions
Wasn't this always supposed to be a rebuilding year?
I get that this was an awful loss and it shouldn’t happen. But, when you’re playing so many inexperienced (even if upperclassmen) players at key positions, things like this are going to happen.
I don’t disagree with some of the points made about questionable coaching decisions, but I always hesitate to criticize coaching too much. They don’t make catches, tackle the ball carrier, or pick up a blitz. We’ve got to rely on players without much game experience (especially crunch-time experience). Let them grow.
As for the experienced players (Reiff, Hyde/Prater, etc.): they need to step up. They haven’t been the leaders of the team before, and maybe they weren’t ready to accept that role. The time for that is now.
The fact of the matter is that we have lost a ton of quality players over the past 18 months, and it’s taking its’ toll on the team. Have patience. We’ve got it pretty good. Fans are up in arms about hopefully going to a shitty bowl in an expected down year. Almost exactly two years ago, we were the #4 team in the nation. How many other teams would change places with Iowa?
by One Night Stanzi on Oct 31, 2011 9:26 AM CDT reply actions
No, things like this aren't going to happen
No matter how much we’re rebuilding or inexperienced we STILL DON’T LOSE TO MINNESOTA. According to Sargin there are oodles of FCS teams better than them. Fucking embarrassing.
I meant up and down play.
Poorly written. But agree…the talent level on Iowa should not lose to Minnesota.
by One Night Stanzi on Oct 31, 2011 9:46 AM CDT up reply actions
This is worse than "fucking embarrassing".
This is walk out of the bathroom with your dick hanging out, chunky shit covered TP stuck to your loafer, fresh banana daiquiri vomit your sweater, bloody boogers hanging out of your beak, with the back of your shirt un-tucked embarrassing.
by Stay thirsty, my friends. on Oct 31, 2011 10:29 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Um
They don’t make catches, tackle the ball carrier, or pick up a blitz. We’ve got to rely on players without much game experience (especially crunch-time experience). Let them grow.
Yeah, it’s really on the players. If only there was some group of elder adults who’s sole purpose was to teach or “coach” them to do these things, then it wouldn’t be as much of a problem. Too bad we don’t live in a mythical, fantasy world where this type of job exists.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
Perhaps a reporter, seeing Ferentz in that press conference "I dare you crouch",
could gently ask,
When you lose a game, is there ever any reason other than something called “execution” failure? Or, since “execution” just means how you play the game, can you talk a little bit about why the other team “executed better”?
It’s just such bullshit. Imagine missing an interest payment and violating, say, your net worth covenants on a bank line. You have to go see your banker. “Nothing to see here, we just need to execute better. I’m not discussing matters beyond that.”
We play tackle football.
to be fair
What failure of coaching resulted in 2 missed field goals?
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions
Come on, really?
I can play this game too.
“What failure of coaching resulted in punts?”
“What failure of coaching resulted in dropped passes?”
“What failure of coaching resulted in Vandenberg’s fumble after the sack?”
Fact is, we had a lead against a very bad team with the two missed field goals in the bag. Fact is, I’ve seen better coaching and game-planning from my wife when she tries to play NCAA 12.
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions
Yeah
I get it, I do. That’s why I didn’t cite any of those things. JVB should be learning how to pick up the blitz. The dropped passes, I’m more on the fence on. Obviously you coach guys up on fundamentals but McNutt had dropsies against PSU, looking upfield before securing the ball.
Are we not coaching McNutt properly? Or was it a mental error in a stressful game?
But the field goal? I’m serious, what should the coaching staff have done differently? I don’t think there is any team that feels they need to coach up a kicker on chip shots at this point, including ours.
Now, I get the point that there’s plenty of other errors in the game that are on the coaches, which could have won it for us, but I don’t think it’s unfair to say execution failures contributed to the loss.
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 11:19 AM CDT up reply actions
You're probably a nice dude; most everyone on here is
But you’re missing the point entirely.
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 11:21 AM CDT up reply actions
Help me out then, man
It’s a teachable moment. If you want less idiots saying stupid shit, arm them with knowledge.
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
You're pointing out isolated incidents of failures by players (primarily Meyer)
When we’re talking about a catastrophic failure of the coaching scheme.
You’re saying this: Well, Jason White shouldn’t have dropped that pass.
We’re saying this: Why the fuck are we passing to Jason White in the first place?
by mikjones24 on Oct 31, 2011 11:32 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Thank you
I was struggling where to start, but this is the point.
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions
No that's perfect
And I agree completely. That last drive was utterly inexplicable.
The script I saw playing out was we run the ball, get close, need time-outs, don’t have them because of the coach’s challenge, and lose.
I did NOT expect us suddenly abandon the one thing that’s been working all day and start throwing to … who!?
I get that 100%. Iowa’s penchant for the 3-yard pass on 3rd-and-8 is bizarre. Perhaps it’s because when our opponents have 3rd-and-8, a 3-yard pass invariably produces a 10-yard gain.
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions
.
That last drive was utterly inexplicable.
Sadly, that last drive and last year’s last drives are all explicable. We avoid the 2-minute drill at the end of the first half so often we literally have less familiarity with it than almost any other team in the conference. How on earth could James Vandenberg have any confidence in the 2-minutes drill the way the coach shuts him down at the end of the first half so often.
"I wish you luck with a capital 'F'" - The Real Elvis.
Just so you know,
I’m not going to get into it with you, and that’s because I don’t think you know anything about football, anything about coaching football, or anything about playing football. Feel free to ignore my remarks, in turn.
We play tackle football.
2 out of 3 ain't bad
I don’t know anything about coaching or playing football. I do know a little bit about football, but not much.
It’s an honest question. What failure of coaching caused those missed field goals? That’s a legitimate failure of execution in my book.
And, I acknowledge, there were legitimate coaching failures as well. I was screaming at the TV, “THIS WILL BE AN ON-SIDE KICK, WHY ARE WE PLAYING IT LIKE A NORMAL KICKOFF?!?!?!?!”
And on that last TD, I leaned to my wife and said, “QB keeper.”
As you say, I don’t know anything about football, yet I saw those two plays coming. If I can see it, I don’t get why our coaches don’t see it. I also saw Wisconsin’s fake punt coming last year. I said out loud, “Uh, they’re punting? They won’t get the ball back, I can’t believe they’re punting, that’s got to be a fake.”
Boom. I hate being right.
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions
Well the 23-yarder should never have been kicked.
We went for if on 4th and 6 from their 35, but not from 4th and 2 on their 6? Vandy hasn’t gotten less than 2 yards on a sneak all season and Coker hadn’t rushed for less than 2 yards on the day. Very poor decision.
by 99FormationsButFourWideAin'tOne on Oct 31, 2011 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions
Agre
Yep, I agree with you there, actually. I know WHY they didn’t kick at 4th and 6, because they didn’t think Meyer would make it.
But 4th and 2? Assuming we don’t get, is Minnesota’s offense buried on the 5 yard line as good as 3 points? Because that’s guaranteed; the 3 points (clearly) weren’t.
I get that part, I truly do. When you point out the individual calls, I had the same DOINK question marks over my head while watching the game.
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions
I think we have a 25% chance of making a 4th and 6 and probably a 50% chance of making a 52-yarder.
by 99FormationsButFourWideAin'tOne on Oct 31, 2011 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Are those odds the same
When it’s 4th and 6th against Wintersota?
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions
failure in coaching on the FG's
recruiting a player that can make that field goal consistently
teaching that player to be consistent and making those
If this were a pro franchise, I’d agree. The coach can only do so much with what he’s given by his GM. But Ferentz chooses the players, with everything that entails. Work ethic. Improvement. Readiness. Consistency. Coachability. Talent. (maybe in that order. If the players aren’t consistently executing, even if it’s entirely the players’ faults, it still sits on the coaches. They chose the players that aren’t executing.
meh
tell me one thing they do differently in practice to improve the field goal kicking
Recruiting, I got it, they picked a dud, that’ll happen, no coach is immune. A general goes to war with the army he’s got, so now what? What do they do differently to coach him up? Kick EVEN MORE practice field goals?
I can only think of two things – hire a special teams coach, or (in my opinion, even better), try more 2-minute drills at the end of the first half to give Meyer more long-distance experience under relatively same circumstances.
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 6:54 PM CDT up reply actions
Also,
its worth noting that Meyer has been an otherwise solid kicker this year, in my opinion. This game was a total fluke for him.
It’s sad and funny how often the words “road game” and “fluke” coincide with Iowa football.
Just beat jNW.
by One_ill_KevinJ on Oct 31, 2011 11:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Meyer is no dud
The second field goal was unlucky – it was almost like he’d kicked a soccer ball with his toe. It was all over the place, and frankly a bit unlucky that it veered off the post at the last moment.
That’s pretty much what we can expect from Iowa right now – relatively solid at home (minus the first 2 1/2 quarters with Pitt), incredibly shaky on the road, to the point that they can (and do) lose to the worst team in the conference in consecutive seasons. It’s who we are right now.
Comedy is where the mind goes to tickle itself.
If Iowa had played lights out and lost on two missed FGs this would be worth noting.
Iowa did not lose because of two missed field goals.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Nov 1, 2011 3:23 AM CDT up reply actions
I made a comment similar to this after the PSU loss
And got crucified.
Belay my last.
by steaming_pile_of_awcrap on Oct 31, 2011 11:04 AM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, well, Minnesota ain't Penn State.
Tom Bradley for offensive coordinator.
by ReadingRambler on Oct 31, 2011 11:25 AM CDT up reply actions
Both of their coaches are near-death and very likable fellows
Otherwise, no similarities whatsoever.
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 11:26 AM CDT up reply actions
Best comment of the day.
Because in a thread so full of painful truths…this is the truest one.
by One Night Stanzi on Oct 31, 2011 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree completely
But you’re talking about level of competition, I’m not. Coaching is/was my focus.
Belay my last.
by steaming_pile_of_awcrap on Oct 31, 2011 5:45 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Was last year a rebuilding year?
Correct me if I’m wrong, but last year we were pretty fucking stocked with talent and we exited games doing the following:
- Failure to spot and plan for unique trends (i.e., fake punts, onside kicks)
- Failure to adjust during games
- Failure to motivate
- Failure to execute
- Failure to hold a lead
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
Here's what makes me more upset
Didn’t Chris Doyle essentially facilitate the kidney failures of 13 players after winter break because it was sent to him to figure out which players wanted to be Hawkeyes? After hate-beating the shit out of a very large group of players and scaring them to near-death, we’re having the same exact season we did last year.
Trust me, it’s not the players who are dropping the ball.
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 10:49 AM CDT up reply actions
As a former Division 1 Sculler...
All athletes get murdered in the off-season. Football players get it the worst. Track & Field a close second, in my experience with friends.
Just beat jNW.
by One_ill_KevinJ on Oct 31, 2011 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't doubt that for a second
Hell, that happens in a lot of high school programs as well.
I know that the University’s findings were that nothing was “mandated”. I also know that this program has a curious way of making shit just move along without questioning or inquisition. I learned a long time ago not to take everything the University types out for the press at face value.
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions
13 of them don't end up hospitalized
with a condition that was entirely preventable if the training staff had been doing their fucking jobs.
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
As far as I'm concerned
Doyle not being immediately fired for this is the single worst thing Ferentz has ever done and much bigger deal than any of the strategic issues.
the sheer number make me think it was something fishy
Food borne virus, the team got boozy the night before, something. The odds of getting rhabo are crazy low; the odds of 13 supposedly elite level athletes getting it simultaneously is crazy low. I mean, CRAZY.
John Welbourn, a 10 year Lineman in the NFL, had an interesting take on i the whole thing: http://talktomejohnnie.com/football/iowa-football-rhabdo
Just beat jNW.
by One_ill_KevinJ on Oct 31, 2011 11:32 PM CDT up reply actions
This is what bothers me about Chazz's defenses so much.
And, to be fair, ruperj and others.
They’re defending the coaches to an extreme and then calling out other commenters for beign critical of the coach after “just one loss.” If When Iowa loses three or more games the rest of the year in the similar manner, are they going to say, “It’s just one loss. Why are upset? You’re not a fan. Be positive.” It’s really a head-in-sand comment. Or the complete inability to see the larger picture. (Which is, of course, an odd double-standard because they/he will call someone out for not remembering a record from two or eight years ago but then he/they can’t remember a game from 2 weeks ago.)
meh
by tyger1147 on Oct 31, 2011 3:25 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Yes, they will.
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
I'll Rec that.
Since I’ve been trying for 48 hours to figure out how to say what you just said.
We’re not trying to crucify someone because they lost “on game”. We’re also not trying to crucify someone for not being ranked #1 with sub-par talent in a rebuilding year.
We’re simply fed up with the fact that the losses we have are games that were played and coached EXACTLY the same way, over and over again, with nothing changing and no one learning. Rebuilding years should still show progress from the beginning to the end of the season, regardless of record. And last year, well last year wasn’t even remotely a rebuilding year (considering we had how many players go pro from last year’s team?) and we still had the same results as we’re seeing in this ‘rebuilding’ year.
Football/sports/life in general are not situations that you can nor should ever look at as one isolated event at a time. Success is evaluating your mistakes and fixing them, even if you make other mistakes along the way. It’s a constant process. That’s why they film the games and watch them back during the week. (Or maybe KF doesn’t believe in that, either…)
this feels like HN
I’m frustrated also, but if the players make the plays then we win this game. I’m not mad at them and I feel with proper execution we won that game. I feel norm hasn’t played the d to the best of its abilities given the lack of talent upfront. I banged my head on the wall, was beyond pissed off and now it’s on to fuck Michigan. I think if we go back to most of those games it’s been a lack of executing the game plan n timely mistakes(turnover bad time/spot, onside kick/fake punts), which I put not accounting for on the coaching staff. This hurts but who benefits from all the bitching? Truly look at if we executed and r we having this conversation? That is where I think Kirk is like an nfl guy, he plays the percentages and without execution or with mistakes of non-pros we have these losses we’ve had and it’s time to hang it all out.
You'll figure out what to do, for god's sake your The Boat! - JD Scrubs
by smokinthereiff on Oct 31, 2011 9:31 AM CDT via iPhone app reply actions
Oh great, the "execution"ers have made their way here.
OK, for the sake of argument, let’s accept your premise that the players didn’t execute the plays that were called (this is patently untrue for the first three quarters of this game, by the way; when you call quarters/cover 2 on every defensive play and Minnesota repeatedly attacks the known weaknesses of those systems — throw down the sideline and/or overload the zone to one side and roll your QB to that side to give him the option to run — there’s not a bit of execution in the world that is going to help). If it’s true that the gameplan was sound and the players didn’t execute it properly, whose fault is that? How is it that we are beaten on execution every goddamned week? Isn’t that also a function of coaching? Isn’t it the job of our vaunted $5M coaching staff to teach the fundamentals so that they can be applied to everyone, or at the very least the worst fucking team in a generation of Big Ten football? Isn’t it the job of the coaches to identify and recruit players with enough talent that their athleticism combined with this vaunted “execution” lead to victories?
If this is a gameplan problem — and it is, and deep down you know it — it’s on the coaches. If it’s a preparation problem, it’s on the coaches. If it’s a talent problem, it’s on the coaches. And if it’s a problem with “execution”, it’s still in large part the fault of the coaches.
Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.
by Patrick Vint on Oct 31, 2011 9:38 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
This is so very true.
“Execution” is the catch-all excuse for (a) failure or (b) not wanting to give actual, substantive details on why something is working or not working. It’s insulting, really. What happened on that punt block, coach? We didn’t execute. Why did the fourth quarter defense collapse? Well, we didn’t execute. It’s just a way of vaguely passing blame onto the players, as you note.
by Chris Grovich on Oct 31, 2011 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions
Oh God, we have a young Paterno coaching our team, don't we?
Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.
by Patrick Vint on Oct 31, 2011 10:01 AM CDT up reply actions
how did you get the twitter button in your signature?
and that's another Hawkeye first down... EHAWW!!
"Why are you still alive, coach?"
You didn’t execute.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions
I've said this time and again.
The two coaching buzzphrases of passive-aggressively shifting blame from yourself (as a coach) to the players is “we didn’t execute” and “we lacked fire/intensity/determination.”
meh
I'm tired of hearing about execution
Seriously. The less talented the team is the closer to perfection they have to play. Kids don’t play perfect. That’s why they’re kids. When you add to the fact that the other team is going to exploit you not playing perfectly because they know exactly what you’re doing wrong, you’re boned.
So many people are harping on a few key plays because of a mistake here or there because of a player or two. Those players shouldn’t have had to be perfect because we should’ve never been in this position to begin with. Tell Marcus Coker or McNutt about execution and they’ll slap you in the face. We keep feeding those players the ball and we win easily. We didn’t, because apparently we have to get everyone else involved like this is a peewee fucking baseball game. And because we didn’t get the correct players involved it’s on others to “execute” and save our asses.
"Execution" is just a deflecting way to answer the question "What the hell just happened?"
He’s too belligerent and snide to be reflective in front of the press. And he’s a little too clever to snark, “The other team played better and scored more.”
Sure, Iowa didn’t execute a lot of things. A lot of the things they didn’t execute they didn’t execute against Tennessee Tech. Which returns us to the “What the hell just happened?” point of departure.
We play tackle football.
It's truly stunning
how little responsibility (read: none) Ferentz takes for these losses. It’s always some vague, nebulous problem with the team as a whole, but none of which is on his shoulders. Nice. He’ll take all the upside and praise when things go well, but he has no problem ducking away once the bill comes due.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
That's just not true
“He’ll take all the upside and praise when things go well, but he has no problem ducking away once the bill comes due.”
I’m staying out of all this for the most part, as there is simply not much to say about that performance. It was bad, bad, bad.
However… You can complain that you don’t get the answers and responses you want in the bad times, but the first part of that statement is false. KF is not some glory hound who takes all the credit and places all the blame.
by H I McDonnough on Oct 31, 2011 11:05 AM CDT up reply actions
Exactly wrong
Kirk is the opposite of a coach who throws his team under the bus. At the press conference on Tuesday, he was asked about the lack of energy for his players during the 2010 game against Minny and he was quick to point out that the coaches failed as well.
HoyaGoon, see Steve Alford for a coach who blames players, i.e. “I told them they were going to beat us on three pointers. I knew it, but my players didn’t listen.”*
*Grossly exaggerated quote.
by TangerinePony on Oct 31, 2011 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions
What part of
“We didn’t execute” is on the coaches? That’s just blaming the players for not performing, albeit in a subtle manner. And the players know it.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
Coaches can fail to execute as well.
With the gameplan, with executing adjustments, etc.
by clay-born to party on Oct 31, 2011 12:52 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree
but that’s not what he means when he says it.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
As we've discussed many times
“not executing” is code for “I don’t want to f*cking talk about this with a bunch of ninny reporters and I am not going to go into details about what we will be practicing this week and therefore give our next opponent a heads up.”
BTW, if you want a heads up Michigan, do anything on offense. We can’t stop you.
by TangerinePony on Oct 31, 2011 3:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, we'd hate to give our opponents a heads up
Because it’s not like they know what we’re going to do already.
Are you fucking kidding me?
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
well
We did open with not one but TWO short passes against Minnesota.
Ooooooooo! Trickery!
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 6:55 PM CDT up reply actions
That was nice of him to accept partial blame 11 months after the game was played
Given that rate, we’ll hear about his performance for the game this past Saturday, oh (checks calendar), Sept. 30, 2012.
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions
Can't believe Kirk and the boys sabotaged GopherQuest like this.
That’s the real crime here.
by Chris Grovich on Oct 31, 2011 9:35 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
OT
but there’s not hamsterdam yet…
Christian Kirksey was singing on the top of his lungs getting his ticket to come into the parking lot :p
and that's another Hawkeye first down... EHAWW!!
by HawkPocket on Oct 31, 2011 9:40 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I don't even know what language this comment is written in.
Before you respond, let me remind you: Brian Cook called me smug, which makes me the Obama of smugness. I'm basically Smugbama.
by Patrick Vint on Oct 31, 2011 9:43 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
You can always use the most recent Hamsterdam.
"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"
Did you note it in your calendar AND trapper-keeper?
They say you're a pitcher, you're sure not much of a dresser. We wear caps and sleeves on this level, son.
I think James Ferentz is avoiding going through my line...
…. probably because I always ask him about football…
and that's another Hawkeye first down... EHAWW!!
I'd make a comment about how not wanting to talk to people about the games runs inn the family
But yeah, I’d avoid you too if I were him. Sorry.
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Nov 1, 2011 5:58 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
and I just called him out on it
THAT’S WHAT YOU GIT!
and that's another Hawkeye first down... EHAWW!!
same
especially when I rewatch shenanigans like this
and that's another Hawkeye first down... EHAWW!!
I wish Kirk would have to spend an afternoon locked in a room watching that and
our other special teams failures from the past 2 years over and over and over.
by HawkeyeRecon on Oct 31, 2011 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions
The problem on that play?
We just didn’t execute.
by EastLosRandy on Oct 31, 2011 10:24 PM CDT up reply actions
Exactly!
The game plan on that play was for #3 (White?) to push those three charging Gophers back, while #29 (Nielsen?) dove 15 yards to cover the kick.
Simple, really. They both just failed to execute.
Serious question
Look, I’m the first guy to tell you that you go with what you have, and the grass is indeed generally not greener on the other side. With that said, there was an article in the Omaha paper today about Ferentz that really made me think. He got paid around $73k last week to make sure things like this don’t happen and despite losing to what amounts to a I-AA team, he will continue to get paid at around $73k this next week and the next and so on and so forth. Now, I am extremely impressed with the passion of the Hawk fans I’ve met, but to allow him to continue this playing down to competition is mind-boggling. Surely patience has to run out with this, right? So, is there a chance that his seat is actually getting any hotter?
Always check the words with the red squiggly line. They mean you probably screwed up.
Author @ Off Tackle Empire
Its college. It really depends on how the big money donors feel.
The answer? Aliens. Or not aliens.
by Blackheartnopants on Oct 31, 2011 10:05 AM CDT up reply actions
I guess
I’m just surprised that a fanbase that is as passionate as Iowa’s and that seems to have as deep of pockets as Iowa’s would be much more furious at Ferentz year in and year out. Two BCS bowls is awesome. There is no doubt about that. Still, dumb losses are dumb losses and this was an extremely dumb loss. The better question to ask, then, is how long will Iowa fans keep giving Ferentz a pass?
Always check the words with the red squiggly line. They mean you probably screwed up.
Author @ Off Tackle Empire
by KennardHusker on Oct 31, 2011 10:10 AM CDT up reply actions
When we see how passionate he is about keeping his job
aka – how long will he stand by Ken O’Keefe? I think KOK is a slightly bigger issue than KF.
and that's another Hawkeye first down... EHAWW!!
It truly is getting more difficult
He doesn’t seem to show any desire to change or adapt when its abundantly clear it’s needed.
They say you're a pitcher, you're sure not much of a dresser. We wear caps and sleeves on this level, son.
What are you talking about?
He TOTALLY went no-huddle, hurry up offense and said the coaches were doing anything they could to win. Until it didn’t work versus PSU. After which he’s reverted back to the tendencies that didn’t work before.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
and you could tell all along when we were using it
That he hated every second of it. Which is also why we haven’t seen it since.
They say you're a pitcher, you're sure not much of a dresser. We wear caps and sleeves on this level, son.
Which completely belies
his other assertion that he and the coaches are willing to use whatever is necessary to get us the win.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
And that's where I'm losing faith in Ferentz
His numerous assertions that he’ll do whatever it takes to get the win, they have to focus on winning now, etc. are beginning to sound more and more like empty talk.
Comedy is where the mind goes to tickle itself.
Why does Bo Pelini get a pass?
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Give it time.
Tom Bradley for offensive coordinator.
by ReadingRambler on Oct 31, 2011 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions
hirefranksolich.com
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions
I suspect Illinois is better than Nebraska and I suspect Penn State – with a bye week, that defense, and the return of Moye – will physically dominate Nebraska, which, no matter the score, is really the best kind of asskicking.
Tom Bradley for offensive coordinator.
by ReadingRambler on Oct 31, 2011 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions
I would have agreed until approximately 5 p.m. on Saturday.
I take back all my negative comments about Nebraska and their QB who throws 50 yard bombs underhand. Anyone who steps on MSU is a good team.
We play tackle football.
It will take time to convince me Michigan State isn’t a good deal better than Nebraska but coached poorly by Dantonio and company.
Tom Bradley for offensive coordinator.
by ReadingRambler on Oct 31, 2011 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions
I gotta agree with RR...Dantonio is a freak show
and he’s good for at least two mind unbelievably bad games each season. Well, enter ND and Nebraska.
But now that that’s over, they’ll destroy us of course.
"I wish you luck with a capital 'F'" - The Real Elvis.
It isn't based on hard analysis
but I can pretty much guarantee that a Dantonio-coached team will get shellacked in one game a year that they shouldn’t. I don’t know how much that reflects on the winning team.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Illinois better?
I think Penn State can beat Nebraska because that defense is solid through and through. I do not believe in Illinois, though. There is no proof to me that they are better at this point.
Always check the words with the red squiggly line. They mean you probably screwed up.
Author @ Off Tackle Empire
by KennardHusker on Oct 31, 2011 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Sheelhouse or however you say that is quite probably a better quarterback, Jenkins is a better receiver than anyone Nebraska’s had in a long time, and their tailbacks are very solid. Nebraska’s probably a better running team, but not by a whole lot. Moreover, Illinois’s defense is a considerably tougher unit than Nebraska’s. They’re not incredibly talented aside from two or three guys, but they’re very, very disciplined and they do a lot of the “little things” like, you know, tackling, that Nebraska struggles to do consistently.
Illinois would have beaten us if they weren’t retaining Zook as their special teams head coach or whatever. Great special teams for Illinois, oh, yeah.
Tom Bradley for offensive coordinator.
by ReadingRambler on Oct 31, 2011 2:10 PM CDT up reply actions
Illinois is coached by a very strange human.
Coaching: football is a game in which players are told what to do by a coach. So, the coach is a very smart man. If the coach is not smart, football games are confusing. Coach Zook is confusing, and his teams are more confusing. What was the assigned theme for this paper again?
We play tackle football.
How many years does that strange human have on his contract?
If Illinois could hire Bonnie and Clyde to kidnap him, I think they might consider it for a second.
Tom Bradley for offensive coordinator.
by ReadingRambler on Oct 31, 2011 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Mostly because he's not the 5th highest paid coach in football
I really don’t mean to make this a trolling post, and I won’t get into it on who has a better coach. My question really stems from a philosophical standpoint. Most Iowa fans I know put up with Ferentz because he develops good players and is good for mostly positive seasons. Still, it is amazingly well documented that Iowa manages to drop ridiculously dumb games over and over and over (Indiana, Minny, NW, and ISU especially) and then gets a pass.
Anyhow, as for a pass, Pelini is in his 4th season. Solich got four and didn’t get a pass. I guess that’s why it’s so surprising, right? The comparison isn’t quite a fit, yet. Sooner or later, though, that may come to be.
Always check the words with the red squiggly line. They mean you probably screwed up.
Author @ Off Tackle Empire
by KennardHusker on Oct 31, 2011 1:26 PM CDT up reply actions
Solich was a sacrifice that will better protect Polini.
I think it’s a mistake, though, to tie W-2 to expected football outcomes. Ferentz is making the dough because Iowa football is paying for the rest of the athletic department, and it would be catastrophic if Iowa stopped filling Kinnick and going to bowls. Iowa could double his wages and he would be a bargain in that context. Iowa CANNOT go back to where it was in 1978, and it wouldn’t be hard to fall there. It’s different than Nebraska where NU is the only D-I game in the state, and where NU tradition is so much more powerful. Even after 30 years of Fry and Ferentz, Iowa football is probably a fragile success at best.
We play tackle football.
by Bellanca on Oct 31, 2011 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
And I think this is why Ferentz is so self-pitying -- he understands how easy it would be
for Iowa to become like Indiana or Minnesota. Please don’t remind me of the irony embedded in the Minnesota reference.
We play tackle football.
by Bellanca on Oct 31, 2011 1:36 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
i like a lot of your posts
But these two above really hit home
Please don't tell me how you hate BSU or their turf...I know all too well and keep my toliet water blue for a reason.
by BoiseHawk on Oct 31, 2011 11:06 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Solich got screwed
I’m the first to admit he got a raw deal, and I hope the whole athletic department understands that rebuilding takes time. Most likely they won’t. I have at least 1/4 of my friends asking for Pelini’s head because he hasn’t won a MNC yet. They’re idiots.
Getting back to your point, I agree that salary should not necessarily equal wins. A good coach with the ability to put dollars in the pockets of the entire athletic department is worth every dime. I go to Creighton, and that was the sole reason for throwing money at Dana Altman year after year after year. Then, Creighton decided they needed to boost another sport and went after the best Men’s Soccer coach in the business and attendance skyrocketed. Same thing happened at UNO with hockey. Still, with the expectations so high for some modicum of success, aren’t these losses that much more infuriating? If everyone understands that it is possible to succeed (2009 or whatever year the Orange Bowl was), then how can there be back-to-back Minnesota losses against what is arguably the worst stretch of Minnesota football? How can there be back-to-back losses to Minnesota ever?
I understand the fragility of the program. Fans are fickle. Just ask the NBA how that is going for them. Still, if your high-paid coach starts showing patterns of mediocrity, that has to be cause for concern by everyone. At minimum, you want your coach to acknowledge that everything should be (re)evaluated. If not, then maybe a lower paid coach with some energy is what the department should think about. Good insight, though. I think that answers a lot of what I was trying to get at. FWIW, I do think Ferentz is an excellent and classy coach. Not sure if that’s what it takes these days, but I generally have enjoyed the way he coaches football.
Always check the words with the red squiggly line. They mean you probably screwed up.
Author @ Off Tackle Empire
by KennardHusker on Oct 31, 2011 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions
"Infuriating"?
I know you are credulous, so I assume you’ve noticed a few people here are … a little uncomfortable or slightly batshit insane with the outcome of this and other games the past two years.
There can be back-to-back losses to Minnesota the way Nebraska can lose to Iowa State at home. Iowa State, like Minnesota, has a good coach. And there’s a reason we play the games.
Which, I would add, includes a certain game on November 25. I think it’s very likely Iowa is 5-6 going into that game. I guess it’ll be a walkover for the Huskers.
We play tackle football.
Did I ever say that?
No, I do not think that any game is a walkover. I have always said that the Black Friday game will be difficult, if not insane because of the amount of animosity not only between fanbases, but even by players who grew up in the homestates. Please do not try to interpret my thought process as anything but inquisitive.
To this point, my understanding of Iowa is that they win the games they are supposed to, knock off one or two powers-that-be, and lose one or two tossups. Then, they go to a bowl, beat a favorite SEC/ACC/Big XII, and repeat. This team seems to be losing that identity. They also seem to be just going through the motions.
Nebraska did lose to Iowa State, and almost did it again the next year. I understand that games have dramatic outcomes when you least expect it. That doesn’t change the fact that this seems to be systemic lately. One loss to an overmatched team? Fine. Twice? Okay, anomalies happen. Multiple instances of refusing to adjust to a game situation and losing for what amounts to no real good reason? Well, that’s where I start to say these are infuriating. But, that would just be me. I fully admit we probably have much different views of the situation.
Always check the words with the red squiggly line. They mean you probably screwed up.
Author @ Off Tackle Empire
by KennardHusker on Oct 31, 2011 2:01 PM CDT up reply actions
My point is, and you're being defensive,
is that of course you can lose back-to-back to Minnesota. Anybody can lose to anybody. Ask Tuberville.
We play tackle football.
Sorry, I read your post as more attacking
I know anyone can lose anytime. Trust me, I’m a sports fan on many levels and have watched unthinkable games happen because there is nothing more motivating than being told you cannot achieve a goal. That’s not what I was getting at. It’s more a question of how things are handled in the loss. This seems to be a pattern Ferentz has picked up. Then, he basically claims nothing was wrong with his approach. I can kind of buy that, but that still seems a bit defeatist, and if not defeatist, then at least a little stubborn/arrogant. That last part is what would make me angry. When Callahan was coaching Nebraska, he would always blame execution of his schemes as the problem, but usually it was inability or unwillingness to adjust. Ferentz is a much better coach than Callahan, but that attitude generally pisses off a fanbase.
Always check the words with the red squiggly line. They mean you probably screwed up.
Author @ Off Tackle Empire
by KennardHusker on Oct 31, 2011 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions
That's not what Ferentz is doing.
Ferentz, when he makes those comments, is just saying, “No comment, and how much longer are we going through this?”
We play tackle football.
That's almost worst, right?
Whether he likes it or not, he is the representation of wins and losses for the University of Iowa. As we already discussed, he is paid to put fans in the stadium and he is paid well. If he becomes glib and disenchanted with the press, to the point of petulance, shouldn’t that be a red flag that things are starting to slip? At what point does a fanbase pick up on these things and start to ask questions about his credentials as their coach? Again, I think this is a little overreaching after a one point loss to a rival in their stadium. If this doesn’t at least raise some eyebrows, which it obviously has, what will it take?
Always check the words with the red squiggly line. They mean you probably screwed up.
Author @ Off Tackle Empire
by KennardHusker on Oct 31, 2011 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Sorry, I missed that.
Thanks for putting up with my questions today. I really do think this is a fascinating thing to watch. Coaches in college football get a lot of hell after painful losses and initially the vitriol was out in full force from Hawkeye fans. This seems a little more focused, and while I think Ferentz makes mistakes, he’ll probably be forgiven if he keeps running the program the Iowa way. Iowa is similar to Nebraska in that you want someone to understand the people who drive to the stadium on Saturdays, play tough football day in and day out, and be willing to adjust. If you beat Michigan this week, that will quiet things down. I’m excited to watch.
Always check the words with the red squiggly line. They mean you probably screwed up.
Author @ Off Tackle Empire
by KennardHusker on Oct 31, 2011 3:34 PM CDT up reply actions
It is hard to get worked up about this
It is typical for long term coaches. JoePa is the classic example. Anyone that has followed PSU football for any number of years could give his pressers for him.
Win – “we played a good game, hats off to the other team for playing hard, they are a good team. We have a lot of stuff to clean up if we want to improve.” Then he give the injury updates he wants to give
Lose – “we played a good team, they beat us today, I can’t take anything away from what they did out there. Obviously we have a lot to work on if we are going to be a better football team next week.” Then he gives the injury reports he wants to give.
"Sometimes the truth gets in the way of a good story" - KF
by The Bacon Explosion on Oct 31, 2011 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions
The answer is because Iowa will find a way to win something it shouldn't
Like last year, living through a depressing shit storm, then beating #12 Mizzou in exciting fashion.
Like looking like dog crap in 2006-07 then getting up off the mat and having winnning seasons capped by pretty big (Outback, Orange) bowl wins the next two seasons.
It would not suprise me AT ALL if Iowa beats either Michigan or MSU at home. They can score lots of points at home.
Also, Ferentz salary is based on market value and past performance. It is what it is. Iowa went the route of booting a coach who really plateaued in wins in effort to reach the “next level” and it damn near MURDERED our once proud basketball program. So I think there is a LOT of unease at the thought of jettisoning a proven winner with some bad current tendencies in KF in an effort to “get to the next level.”
At least that’s how I feel.
by Torbee on Oct 31, 2011 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Give him a month
and Ferentz can prep a team better than just about anybody. If we only played once a month, we’d be 11-1 at worst every year.
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
I'm a pretty big Kook-Aid drinker, I admit
I actually enjoyed much of last year. Those games against very good Ohio State and Wisconsin teams were vastly entertaining and evenly matched. It sucks Iowa came out on the losing end, but they were high caliber, good football games.
That said, the last two results against Minnesota are bafflingly pathetic and totally inexcusable.
While I think some changes in the program MUST be made this year, I’m not even slightly close to wanting to be rid of KF.
BTW, if we continue playing like this, you guys are going to kill us
I can see Nebraska putting up at least 50 on us and seeing a really ugly blowout.
Never *question* Bruce Dickinson!
http://www.thebirdcult.net
by The Bird Cult on Oct 31, 2011 5:22 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm sure Minnesota fans said that too
See, I think Nebraska is the better team on paper right now and I know having home field advantage against a team who seems to hate the road is also a huge swing in the Husker’s favor. With that said, I’ve watched too many games against bad Colorado, Iowa State, and Missouri teams that decided they wanted to win that day. Also, this might be Iowa fighting for a bowl game berth. I’m predicting a Nebraska win, but not a blowout… unless Iowa has absolutely self-destructed by then. Then we will need to reassess motivations.
Always check the words with the red squiggly line. They mean you probably screwed up.
Author @ Off Tackle Empire
by KennardHusker on Nov 1, 2011 9:05 AM CDT up reply actions
Road Games in the Central Time Zone are always very difficult.
Iowa needs to give Kirk another million and an extension so that he doesn’t jump to the NFL. There will be 6 to 8 openings and they will all want the guy who won the 2004 Capital One Bowl with his deft clock management skills.
by Reggie Roby's Wrist Watch on Oct 31, 2011 10:05 AM CDT reply actions 2 recs
This is hilarious
But I’m not sure NFL teams are looking for college success the way parallel collegiate teams do. Charlie Weis was an offensive coordinator after basically running ND into the ground (when it as pretty far down to begin with). Everybody worships Ferentz for finding talent, developing it, and playing cohesive games. It may baffle us (it baffles me), but NFL teams pick their guy and go with it. He is the apple of a few team’s eye.
Just beat jNW.
by One_ill_KevinJ on Oct 31, 2011 11:05 AM CDT up reply actions
No, he's not
The bloom is decidedly off this rose. The only ones repeating the “KF can always go to the pros” mantra are the same fans who refuse to question anything he does, convinced that doing so will drive him away from us.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
As a fan I'm still so pissed I can not form a coherent thought
For all the defenders of KF: Why is it unreasonable for a fan base of a team paying a coach the 5th highest salary in college football to expect that coach to field a top 10 team?
I understand that you’re going to have up and down years, but this? I think we will lose out the rest of the season and finish 5-7, yet I’m not supposed to be pissed? If not for a dropped pass last year we are 6-6 with a team that was loaded with NFL caliber players, yet I’m not supposed to be pissed…
Are we not supposed to aspire to greater heights because we’re Iowa? That is total bullshit! And if you truly believe that, you should nut punch yourself. right now. until you pass out. Then. Rinse. AND. Repeat.
If, as Iowans, we shouldn’t expect better then the 5-7 to 7-5 range then we should save the university money and KF takes a pay cut.
I think KF & Co. does a hell of a job coaching players. I don’t think he should be allowed in the stadium for the games.
Oh and watch the post-game presser again. When he’s asked about Vandy not being able to pick up a corner blitz (Turn up the volume for that question) he says ‘Yeah, well you got me there’ before he gives his non-answer and tries to redirect that it was a safety blitz. (like it fucking matters!!!!) That is supposed to be acceptable?!?!?
Because you can't buy it
If all it took was enough hot cash injection to field a top 10 team year in and year out, schools would just spend the money and do it. you can’t buy wins like that.
look.
there are teams that are top 10 year-in and year-out. boise state comes to mind. do you want to be boise state? I don’t. I’d rather earn wins instead of padding my schedule with cupcakes and playing 2 meaningful games a year.
Who else is in the top 10 every year, year in and year out, without fail?
Florida? Florida State? Texas? Oregon? Alabama? Auburn? Ohio State? Nebraska? USC?
There are teams with enormous recruiting advantages over us who don’t perform much better.
We’re Iowa. Your expectations are ridiculous and unreasonable. Yes, it’s utterly unreasonable to expect a coach, even if you paid him a trillion dollars, to field a top 10 team simply because he’s paid that much.
And if you want to argue that we could pay somebody else much less to get the same results, I ask you which much coach’s record in the Big 10 over the last 10 years do you want who was paid a fraction of Ferentz’s salary?
Dantonio? Brewster? Zook? I’ll even throw Beliema in here. Wisconsin’s collapse in the middle of this season has been spectacular to behold. They were lucky to get out of Iowa City with a W last year.
I share everybody’s criticisms of Ferentz and I agree that he’s paid a lot and our expectations are high, and we expect more than what he’s getting. There is no excuse for yesterday. And, if the trend doesn’t reverse, the time may come to shake things up. But I’m not ready to kick the guy out just yet. And frankly, we could go 7-6 next year and I still won’t be. I’ll allow two “down years” to recruit and rebuild before I start hollering.
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions
Um
I’d rather earn wins instead of padding my schedule with cupcakes and playing 2 meaningful games a year.
That’s great. But we’re not getting the wins. And we’re still losing to the cupcakes (of the conference).
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
Then why do we pay it?
We’re Iowa. Your expectations are ridiculous and unreasonable. Yes, it’s utterly unreasonable to expect a coach, even if you paid him a trillion dollars, to field a top 10 team simply because he’s paid that much.
Then why pay it? If ’We’re Iowa’ so shucks we can’t be winners then why pay it? Maybe Bob Cummings had a kid and would be willing to coach for us…
And why is it ‘ridiculous’? Because we are small populace state is not really a valid answer if you ask me.
I’ll allow two "down years" to recruit and rebuild before I start hollering.
Do you mean two more starting from now? Because by my count this is already year two…
No
Basically going back to the middle of last year. I think next year needs to be in the 7-5 range (4-4 big 10, at worst), or Ye Olde Coache is in trubba.
As BamaHawkeye wrote over at OTE, The Ferentz Era is following the same script as a lot of great coaches — it’s a classic five-part Greek tragedy, where the “falling action” is truly earning its name.
My question is whether the denouement will involve a peaceful reconciliation with the fan base, a la Hayden Fre, or if Ferentz will become a university pariah. I really like the guy, but it’s hard to imagine an end to his career that goes well. I hope he pulls off another freakish 2009-like season, wins a Rose bowl, and retires after that. I think we’d all be at peace.
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 12:08 PM CDT up reply actions
I can swallow 7-5 this year
it is a rebuilding year (7-5 last year, though, was completely unacceptable). The problem with this is, 7-5 is most likely outside the realm of possibility here. You don’t get there when you lose to an absolutely terrible program, which Minnesota is right now.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
I could swallow 5-7
and I could even take losing to ISU and Minnesota. What I can’t take is going 5-7 by making the same damn mistakes and not learning from them every single year. I would be a lot less upset about losing to the Gophers if we’d recovered that fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffing onside kick, or if we’d even shown some awareness that it could possibly happen. Getting ambushed like that is pretty hard to swallow.
"You start to get out of bed, you say, 'Oh, [expletive], I only got one leg on, I better get the other leg on.'" -- Norm Parker
I don't recall Fry being accused of incompetence.
the game had passed him by, his staff wasn’t what it used to be, the Big 10 was tougher in the 90’s, but not incompetence and (worse) ubris. Which is the basic charge against Ferentz right now. Also, Fry was both a savior and a character, KF isn’t either one. I think KF will be remembered as a mostly really good coach, but he won’t be loved like Hayden.
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
Oh and by the way
It’s not the kids that are failing; it’s the craptastic coaching staff that is failing. So the recruiting argument is bunk, IMO.
Is that you, Jon Miller?
I don’t think there’s any regular here (I think) saying that Kirk Ferentz needs to be fired. However, I tire of the “be careful what you wish for” attitude because it’s completely missing the point. You talk about Iowa being elite and for those being unreasonable expectations. I don’t care that Iowa isn’t elite. I care that Kirk Ferentz’s teams of late don’t look like Iowa teams and we’re losing football games we shouldn’t be.
I don’t care how many players we put in the NFL. That doesn’t win us football games right now. I don’t care about our recruiting disadvantages. The guy before Kirk Ferentz never used that as an excuse.
And guess what, those other teams you mentioned, don’t lose inexcusable football games on a consistent fucking basis.
So spare me the “we can’t do better” argument. For 4 million dollars a year, there’s ALWAYS someone who can do better. That’s not what I want, but for you to say it isn’t possible is ridiculous.
I think a lot of regulars
are on the verge of calling for his head. I fully expect, about a year from now, to log into this site and see a post with a title similar to “Kirk Ferentz Needs To Be Fired”.
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
I call dibs on FireKirrkFerentz.com.
by Stay thirsty, my friends. on Oct 31, 2011 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions
I've been in the firing camp since 2007
But I’ve gotten knocked around on the boards for not being a KF fan. I really honestly think that Iowa needs a more enthusiastic coach to succeed in ANY sport – not just football. Dr. Tom, despite his mellow personality, could be a fired up guy. Alfraud was fired up in the wrong way – he’d blame the players for his failures. Seeing the video of Fran chest bumping the players after the IU win last year – I can’t see Ferentz chest bumping ANYBODY even at gunpoint.
We don’t need to talk about Lick, his indifference/whateverthefuckit was took what good we had left in basketball apart. Fortunately, with the right guy, you can rebuild in basketball a lot faster than you can in football.
Same with wrestling… Dan was in your face, then we had a guy that wasn’t Dan… then we went and got the guy that’s the most like Dan out there available that isn’t a clone of Gable…
That said, we could fire Kirk tomorrow, and for what we pay we can find someone who will do as good and probably a much better job.
Never *question* Bruce Dickinson!
http://www.thebirdcult.net
by The Bird Cult on Oct 31, 2011 5:36 PM CDT up reply actions
Hate to add this but...
When the decision was being made to hire KF, the men’s Final Four was in Atlanta. Bobby Stoops was also looking for a head coaching job. He walked in our suite at the hotel and told them. (AD was Bob Cummings?) told Stoops, “thanks, and we’ll keep you in mind, however we’re conducting a national search.”
Stoops went down the hall and talked to Oklahoma. They hired him on the spot. Iowa then offered KF.
by Vandy's Mom Digs Me on Oct 31, 2011 8:30 PM CDT up reply actions
Our AD was Bob Bowlsby
and Stoops apparently told Iowa not to put him in a position where he had to say no. Had Hayden left a couple years sooner we may have had him, for awhile at least, but in 98, Oklahoma was looking, too. Iowa just didn’t stand a chance.
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
Vint has had a bunch that might as well be titled that
And there are lot of people who will say as much without actually writing those exact words. That way if he does turn things around everyone can turn around and make fun of all those crazy folks who were calling for his head, just like we did after the end of ’08 and ’09.
While not for us fans
The ultimate goal for the majority college players is to make it to the NFL. Yeah it sucks for us fans when our players aren’t developed enough right now, but maybe Kirk’s goal is to get people into the NFL..
by clay-born to party on Oct 31, 2011 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Which in turn helps with recruiting
It’s a fine line…we can recruit by developing players into NFL options, and one of the ways we do that is by running pro-style sets. So, that’s a question. Can we get those projects with different styles? Maybe, maybe not. And without those guys, you don’t get 2009 (or 2002). Even last year, if we had one or two more healthy LBs and one lightning strike less from AIRBHG, we probably win a couple of the close ones and have a 9 or 10 win season (even with the negative mental atmosphere that, I imagine, wasn’t entirely due to the coaching staff. I can’t imagine none of DJK’s baggage leaked into practices). So, let’s not pile on the NFL prospects quite yet.
Who is saying we should be top 10 every year?
The complaint seems to be “We keep losing games we should not lose”.
And frankly, we should, more often than not, be top25, if not 20. Being ranked should not be a special fucking treat.
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
Heart
Plain and simple, it is time for new leadership. A lose is a lose I get it. What I have a problem with is the lack of heart. This coaching staff has no heart, this team, following there leader has no heart. Minnesota jumping up and down, totally into the game, when is the last time you saw a Hawkeye team act that way?? Hell if we have one player that gets emotional KF puts him in his place…..see DJK. Barta needs to tell KF that it is time for a new OC and DC, if KF refuses them he needs to go. The lack of heart on this team is unacceptable. God next week is going to be ugly. Anybody want my tickets?
yeah, nobody is emotional...
what a completely untrue statement.
"a lose is a lose"?
I’m loset.
You got no fear of the underdog; That's why you will not survive!
by YouCanPutYourEddsInIt on Nov 1, 2011 9:27 PM CDT up reply actions
This game was mailed in.
I defy anyone to find a single game where one team could run at will, and, without an apple cart of turnovers, lost. That’s because any other program would have run for 400, and this would have been a tidy little 30-3 Brent Metcalfe super-decision. Iowa needed exactly four offensive plays to win this game. Is there a coach in the country who would not have run the ball with 2:48 left.? (The UM prof I attended with, who was a right guard on our team, looked at me and yelled, “I can’t believe they’re not giving it to Coker! At least once!”) It would have been better than this sequence:
1: TE stops running, ball hits ground.
2. Drop, short of first down anyway.
3. Drop, short of first down anyway.
4. Panic attack, penalty.
5. Suicide scramble.
Anyone who watched the PSU game had already seen that series.
I am curious why the most difficult thing in the world is to teach a senior DE to not fucking crash the interior line when he has outside contain on a running QB (yielding two scores in the 4Q). Anyone who watched any game other than NW had already seen that behavior.
I am curious why our coaches hate thinking about special teams. We should start a pool before each game that pays out if you correctly identify the special teams “Special Collapse” play.
I am curious why our QB does not locate the fucking defensive backs, much less the safety, when the first thing a QB does approaching the line is read his safeties. Maybe we haven’t had time to practice that in the past three years. Anyone who watches football sees a QB swiveling his head and pointing to his safety reads.
There’s nothing much we can do about the DL and linebacker physical problems. We’re just small and not very tough. The other stuff makes me seriously question the sincerity of a staff, that lives off the enthusiasm of their fan base, and then snorts drivel about execution when asked how it is possible to lose to the worst team in the Big Ten since 1981.
When a guy drives a $250,000 combine into the ditch, imperiling the harvest, he doesn’t walk home and tell his wife, “We just need to execute better, honey.”
We play tackle football.
by Bellanca on Oct 31, 2011 10:29 AM CDT reply actions 8 recs
One nit to pick
I can’t put all the blame on Binns for the blown contain. He literally hurdles Christian Kirksey trying to race fot the edge. I have to assume since Kirksey was blitzing he had outside contain and Binns was supposed to go inside.
No fucking clue why Kirksey didn’t stay more outside.
Didn't the first 4Q TD go to the defense's right?
Truth be told, I can’t remember. I know the last one went to Binns’ side, but he couldn’t get out there because another Iowa defender (Kirksey) was literally blocking him from doing so.
FTR, I am pissed that Kirksey decided blitzing meant he should play nose guard for a play.
Rec'd
so well written and yet so sad and disappointing at the same time.
by Iowa Refugee on Oct 31, 2011 12:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Uggh.
Anyone who watched the PSU game had already seen that series.
by DJK's bongwater on Oct 31, 2011 4:26 PM CDT up reply actions
Here's more good news!
If we lose out, not only will we be 5-7 and miss a bowl, our record in November the past two seasons will be a tidy 0-8! EVERYTHING IS FINE!
That warm, wet sensation running down your back?
It’s just rain.
Kirk Ferentz
by Stay thirsty, my friends. on Oct 31, 2011 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I was fuming after this game
And my wife, ever the voice of football reason in our house, said, “Did, or did not, Iowa play well?” I said, “Mostly, yeah.” “Did, or did not, Minnesota play well?” I said, “Mostly, yeah.” She said, “So both teams played well, and Iowa lost a close game, is that right?” I said, “Yeah, I think mostly, yeah.” She said, “Then stop dogging on the Hawkeyes, they’re my Hawkeyes too and I won’t have you talking about them that way.”
I started in on the coaches. “I SAW that on-side kick coming, why didn’t THEY see that on-side kick coming?” She said, “Which coach missed two easy field goals, again? Which coach was that?”
It’s a bunch of things. But here’s one thing to take away:
Even with this loss, we could theoretically make it to the Big 10 championship game by just winning out. The teams we’re competing with for that spot are Nebraska, Michigan, and Michigan State. We have OWNED MU and MSU for the last few years, and we’ve got them at home, and we’re PISSED. If we deal out wins against those teams, we’ve all got 2 Big 10 losses, people, and we’ve got the heads-up tiebreaker. We can take care of Purdue on the road, that sets up Nebraska as THE GAME>
Now. I know we’re concerned about the Michigans. And I’m with you — the chances are NOT GOOD. But the Big 10 is weird this year, and we’re not out of it yet. I think it’s going to be a wild ride to the finish, and so long as we win just one of the Michigan games, we’re still not out of it yet.
Let’s be realistic about the team, and let’s play for what we can play for. I think a bowl game is a realistic goal, and I think just having Iowa in the conversation for Big 10 champion, going into the last week of the season, is an accomplishment.
This is Iowa football, people. NOTHING comes easy here. It never has, it never will, and every year it will get harder and harder to be successful here.
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
I disagree
Reading this, I don’t feel the post is trying to be peace/love/and KF is the bees knees.
I think he (and maybe not his non-pissed) he is pissed at this game, optimistic as you can be at this point, and understanding the Iowa was not a favorite at all and this season was going to be an uphill battle.
I just don’t get why it has to be doom and gloom here. Am I pissed at the same KF fails every damn time…FUCK YES I AM. However, we could still win out. Will we? Probably fucking not, but why assume failure? Why is any post that don’t just rehash KFs flaws a post that just missing the point
Please don't tell me how you hate BSU or their turf...I know all too well and keep my toliet water blue for a reason.
by BoiseHawk on Oct 31, 2011 11:28 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Interwebz rumblings are though?
Or is asserting ones opinion as more on point a plan?
I just enjoy being a Hawkeye, watching the Hawks play, reading the BHGP articles, and for the most part reading other peoples posts on here. I just try to be realistic about Iowa’s chances. While frustrated by KF and staff at times, I take them for what they are—I am not here to be an apologist, but for fucks sake, we are going to lose from time to time. To think a poster here has all the answers is ridiculous.
I just enjoy that others find some of same things bullshit, or awesome (when times are good). I offer no plan. I don’t think that is the point of these boards.
Please don't tell me how you hate BSU or their turf...I know all too well and keep my toliet water blue for a reason.
Fail. Get Fired. Become sideline commentator for FX.
by mikjones24 on Oct 31, 2011 11:15 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
I'm not happy with some trends with Iowa football for the last 12 months
But, if KF ended up taking a job in the “media”?
// head asplodes at the irony
by iowabeakster on Oct 31, 2011 7:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Hey, pass that along bro
…takes huge hit.
Ruminates for several moments.
Exhales.
That is some excellent stuff, where can I get some.
Thanks, it all seems better now.
"Beware... there are mine fields out there. Most of them are inert. However, some of them are ert."
LOL
“Even with this loss, we could theoretically make it to the Big 10 championship game by just winning out.”
And monkeys could theoretically fly out of my ass, very small ones albeit.
by Stay thirsty, my friends. on Oct 31, 2011 10:43 AM CDT reply actions
LOL x2
The most messed up part of that statement being that we weren’t SUPPOSED to win most of the rest of the games this season, so now we’re really screwed. I think everyone on this board was ok with Iowa having a so-so record this year, but the hardest games are yet to come and we’ve already lost some of the games we were supposed to win. It doesn’t leave much hope for the rest of the year.
Losing does not equal fury on BHGP, but losing the gimmies does. That’s the point most of the sunshine and rainbows kids are missing right now.
What's truly miserable is that we are a lock for This Week in Schadenfreude.
It will be a State of Iowa Special Addition, only we’ll be on the dais with Texas Tech, not ISU.
We play tackle football.
by Bellanca on Oct 31, 2011 11:30 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
When Ferentz says "We didn't execute"
he means “the players lost the game by not playing well enough.”. He’s not blaming the game plan, or the play calling, or lack of motivation, or anything that the coaching staff did or did not do. He’s blaming the players.
Think they haven’t figured that out?
(to be fair, he does kinda acknowledge that certain plays were not the right ones)
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
He said WE didn't execute
Not, the players didn’t execute. Gameplan, adjustments, game management, etc. all falls under the realm of needing to be executed better.
by clay-born to party on Oct 31, 2011 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Coaches always refer to their team as "we".
It’s just the lingo. His tone/body language/etc definitely does not imply his own involvement. It comes off as snarky and above it all.
Can I psychoanalyze for a moment?
I agree with the mods and the majority of posters on this board regarding WHAT happened yesterday – and worse many many other times in the past. But now that the “what” is pretty well recognized, let’s go a step further. Why does Ferentz do this? Why does he play conservatively, to a fault? Why does he continually mismanage the clock? Why does he refuse to accept another team may take some special teams risks? Why does he put Brad Herman and Jason White in potentially game-ending situations (true, Vandenberg chose to throw to them, but he has a hell of a time NOT throwing to his first option)? Why does he refuse to adjust?
I’m afraid. I’m afraid because I think he feels like it is more important to take a lower-than-average talent team (especially on defense) and essentially give up on winning as the main goal, and instead preach his philosophy as being all important. And you will LOSE your morale if this happens. Because a 20 year old KID (and let’s face it, you are not an adult when you are 20, you are a kid) doesn’t want to have football be a job. I don’t think anyone does. They want to win, they want it to be enjoyable. It’s hard enough to have fun when you lose, and it’s even harder when you lose in a stale, vanilla, milktoast manner, when your coach doesn’t seem to have the energy or intuition or will to make the right coaching decisions. Before you bitch at me: 4 million a year, he better fucking be brilliant at this aspect of his job. Coker was about the only person I saw Saturday who had any fire, and he had to get 250 FUCKING yards to reach that point! And sure this style may work when you have solid team talent, but we don’t and he is FUCKING FAILING.
So I guess what I’m saying is that maybe Ferentz is getting lazy. Maybe the game is passing him, although is it really any different than 10 years ago? I highly doubt he has lost the skills that got him here. What I REALLY think, is that he has become the grizzled old man on his porch yelling at the neighborhood kids who play on his sidewalk. “This is MY game, you have no place here! I’m not gonna change because the way I am got me here!” And if he doesn’t want to change, is seemingly content with a 5-7 or 6-6 record, if my theory is correct, then he should be done. His apathy is giving me little reason to care about this TEAM anymore, but I will watch and support and live and die emotionally through our PLAYERS forever.
Go Hawks.
I will haunt your dreams and eat your children.
The problem is he never really changes anything
And everyone has figured out how he plays every down of every game.
by 99FormationsButFourWideAin'tOne on Oct 31, 2011 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions
And it happens to most coaches, unless you're running a powerhouse program with absolutely mosterous talent.
See BamaHawk’s open letter to Ferentz.
by 99FormationsButFourWideAin'tOne on Oct 31, 2011 2:23 PM CDT up reply actions
to be fair
We had a couple of 4th down tries, an actual successful end-around and an eligible tackle reception in this game. While there wasn’t a lot of blitzing, uh, you didn’t really need it for the vast majority of the game. This season, we’ve seen a fair amount of situational 3-4 (impressive, given the linebacker numbers) and nickel coverage. We’ve seen no-huddles, shotguns, 3 TE sets, and empty backfield sets. There’s been a lot of different things that the coaches have done. Also, on the onside kick, Kill even said that they took the onside kick after they saw Iowa didn’t have the hands team out there. In the position they were in, it was perfectly reasonable to think that A) They didn’t want to be backed up on the 15 (bernstine wasn’t tearing it up on returns) and B) the D could stop a Minnesota drive.
This is the definition of an upset
It is not representative of the entire season or program, so let’s not extrapolate too far.
Don’t forget that we beat them horribly on offense AND on defense for 3 quarters. They won this game on…
A) Fluke sack and Vandy fumble
B) Fluke onsides kick (which yes, we should have seen coming)
C) Fluke missed FGs
D) Fluke free hot dog day that pumped up the fans
E) Fluke of letting Greg Castillo into the game on kickoff coverage
We win this game 29/30 times. Pat Harty’s “Now We Are Worse Than New Mexico State” Comparisons are ridiculous.
But this was game 30
Even with all the flukes, we should have won this dam game by 14. Minnesota if horrible this year.
USC L 19-17
New Mexico State L 28-21
Miami (Oh) W 29-23
North Dakota State L 37-24
Michigan L 58-0
Purdue L 45-17
Nebraska L 41-14
Iowa W 22-21
Purdue, who is also not good, put 45 up on them. We couldn’t manage half that. Michigan was 58-0, that just doesn’t happen in conference games. That’s a D2 cupcake game score. Same with Nebraksa.
Our talent may be a bit lacking this year, but we’re better than Minny almost across the board.
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
the score says otherwise.
Perhaps Minny is improving. Didn’t Brewster have higher rated recruiting classes than us?
by GuttedSnowBird on Oct 31, 2011 3:01 PM CDT via iPhone app up reply actions
improving?
they’ve been in a slide since the USC game, but all of a sudden they beat us. No, that there is evidence that there’s apparently two dumpster fires, one is out of control while the other is building its way up to inferno.
Does this mean we're 59 points worse than Michigan?
It’
by DJK's bongwater on Oct 31, 2011 4:31 PM CDT up reply actions
We may win it 29 out of 30 times
But I doubt it. You know why? Because we’ve now lost the same game, to the same team, twice in 11 months.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
I admit
We make the Greg Castillo fluke alot.
by TangerinePony on Oct 31, 2011 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions
There are issues, but...
Our defensive line is a steaming pile of shit. There is not a scheme that can possibly work with it. Blitz more? Die by getting burned on outside protection or keep giving up the 3-5 yard routes that are already killing us. Press and more man to man? Get slanted to death or burned by inadequate cover corners.
offensively, you want to keep pounding the call? Who the fuck else is going to carry it? Coker us only human, and no man can take the type of punishment he is without getting hurt. Coker goes down and an inconsistent offense becomes worthless. not only that, id like to see the kid next year without an exploded joint. Same said for vandy. Our scheme is not the issue.
There is no depth at linebacker. There is no
depth on either line. There is no depth at rb. There us no depth in the secondary. These are the issues. We can have talent at wide out and qb out the ass, but it doesnt mean shit in this league. Just look at michigans blow ups the last two years.
I’m not giving ferentz a pass. More than any other game I have ever watched, saturdays result pissed me off to no end. But we have to look at reality. Regardless of top line talent, football is won by depth, especially in a top
tier league. Iowa is not the type of place where you can pull in high quality talent to sit for years, waiting their turn. Never has been, never will be. As fun as campus can be, nobody likes freezing their balls off in winter
r and having the threat of blizzards in march. Especially when there are offers to go elsewhere.
by Drake Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 11:38 AM CDT via mobile reply actions
Phone fail, I wasnt done
The issue is that for several years, we have not been able to keep these players that we and develop at positions of need in the program.
The problem is conditioning. I’m tired is seeing our defense faded at the end of games.
the problem is multifaceted, and a simple coaching change would only serve to exacerbate our problems for several years to come. I’m not pleased, but think rationally. A new coach means we start from scratch right now. I’ll take this frustrating shit over becoming a true, honest to god dumpster fire.
by Drake Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 11:43 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
I think this is the first thread I have ever seen on BHGP
where anyone taking an opposing viewpoint is shouted down by multiple people. I didn’t get to watch the game and I don’t really have a comment here but I am disappointed to see this turned into a “its the coaches fault and if you don’t think that ferentz is a cold emotionless overpaid pile of shit then you don’t know anything about football” thread. I think i’ll just wait a few days for it to cool off in here because the more I think about it the more upset I will be and I learned in 2007 that I can’t let what happens to a college football team control my emotions in my life.
He sired a baseball team... An orchestra, if you count the bastards!
by SaturdayMorningKegStanzis on Oct 31, 2011 11:45 AM CDT reply actions 2 recs
I lost you at
I didn’t get to watch the game.
by mikjones24 on Oct 31, 2011 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
When it is 1 man arguing against 100
sometimes it really is the one man standing up to the masses for what’s right and on principle. More often, however, it’s because the one man is fucking wrong. This is a case of the latter.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
not saying i disagree with any of you
i just don’t like the tone that is taken against the 1 person over and over in here.. like i said, its not like BHGP to be that way.
He sired a baseball team... An orchestra, if you count the bastards!
by SaturdayMorningKegStanzis on Oct 31, 2011 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions
Wait till Chazz shows up
then it will be 100 v 2
I think everybody knows none of this is personal. We’re all kinda pissed and this is where we’re gonna vent.
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
It's not personal
but I’ve gotten as sick of the same, tired excuses proffered for every loss that goes the same way as I have of the actual losses.
There are two camps here, the first is the Ferentz is largely to blame camp, the second doesn’t want to hold him accountable at all.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
You have a point there
there is absolutely no conceivable way that someone in this thread could be trying to push a viewpoint that is somewhere in the middle of your “two camps”
He sired a baseball team... An orchestra, if you count the bastards!
by SaturdayMorningKegStanzis on Oct 31, 2011 12:06 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
I hold him accountable
I just take issue with people who think Iowa should be a year-in, year-out BCS contender-caliber team because we pay the coach a lot of money.
I think given the strength of our coaching staff, our recruiting classes, and the school’s intangibles, Iowa fans can realistically expect bowl games year in and year out. At a minimum. To me, that’s 7-5, and that’s a good year.
I think we should realistically expect 8-4 and 9-3 seasons every couple years, and 10-win seasons every 4-5 years.
This team, this year, could and should have beaten ISU. We could and should have beaten Minnesota. We could have beaten PSU, but I’ll stop short of saying we should have.
It’s not unfathomable, given our schedule, that Iowa could be undefeated, or at least a 1-loss team at this point, even in a rebuilding year. If the argument is that a guy who is worth $3 million bucks should be able to produce those results, I get it.
But I’ve seen some downright nutty comments around teh weberntz about Iowa’s placement in the grand scheme of college football and they’re wildly unrealistic.
You paid for what you’ve already done. In every job. Not for what you will do. Your raises are paid because LAST year you were good. Your bonuses are paid because LAST year you were good. You cannot throw money at people and get results. You can only get results and throw money at people to reward them for it.
This whole, “For $3M he can win that game,” thing is silly. If we’re not talking about firing KF and replacing him with somebody cheaper (or more worth $3m) then what are we talking about when we mention the salary?
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Nice straw man
Are there fans who have unreasonable expectations of BCS bowls every year or every 1-2 years? Probably. But I’m confident in thinking few to none are around here.
I’m not asking for undefeated. I’m asking for 7-5 this year, something that looks almost impossible right now. I’m asking for us to beat the teams that we’re supposed to beat more often than we don’t, which we’re not doing. I’m asking for the team to be better at the end of the season than they were at the beginning, but we’re not. But most of all, I’m asking that we STOP MAKING THE SAME FUCKING MISTAKES FROM SEASON TO SEASON AND NEVER LEARN A GODDAMN THING BECAUSE OUR COACH REFUSES TO ADAPT
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
I agree
It’s not a straw man. If you’re saying we could be 7-5, and we should be 7-5, and we would be 7-5 if there were fewer head-scratching coaching decisions, then I don’t think you and I disagree on much. Frankly, given how the schedule is set up and which teams are losing, as recently as Saturday morning it wasn’t unthinkable that Iowa could be playing in Lincoln for the right to attend the B1G championship game. While the straight math for that calculation hasn’t changed (we’d own all the tie-breakers if we won out), the probability certainly seems imperceptibly small.
If we can’t figure out Minnesota’s offense-stuffing blitz packages, how the hell do we hang with MSU?
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions
There are two camps here...
President Bush Great President v. Greatest President
by TangerinePony on Oct 31, 2011 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions
There are two camps here, the first is the Ferentz is largely to blame camp, the second doesn’t want to hold him accountable at all.
And this is the fucking problem.
The next person you touts how much better BHGP is than Hawkeye Message Board X can go fuck themselves. We are no different, no matter how much we try to delude ourselves into thinking otherwise.
"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"
BUT I LISTEN TO NPR! TELL ME I'M BETTER THAN THEM, ROSS!
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions
How much does Ross get paid?
For $20.00 worth of ad space and a free subscription to the already mostly free SB Nation website, I think this blog should be better.
by TangerinePony on Oct 31, 2011 12:29 PM CDT up reply actions
FINALLY!
I want a blogger with a better groomed beard! I want a blogger whose photoshops are somehow shittier! I want a blogger whose self of self-righteousness is practically tangible! GIVE ME BRIAN COOK!
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
I guess I'm a RossWB apologist
Nobody does it better. Keep on truckin’, Ross!
(I don’t want my love for BHGP and Ross to get lost in this rabbit-hole of meta, so if this doesn’t come across correctly I apologize)
I spent half my life's earnings on wine, women & song. The other half I wasted.
by therealCatnuts on Oct 31, 2011 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't want apologists.
I don’t want love.
I don’t want people dividing themselves into camps. The “#Team____” thing is cute, but only as a joke.
I want rational discourse, not people claiming to be rational debaters while demonizing any opposition as torch-wielding, fire-crazed zealots or kool-aid drinking sycophants. But that’s not going to happen, because we are like any other corner of the series of tubes: stupid, polarized, and dogmatic.
"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"
by RossWB on Oct 31, 2011 5:06 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Ha. Now I know Ross' true offline identity
Never *question* Bruce Dickinson!
http://www.thebirdcult.net
by The Bird Cult on Oct 31, 2011 5:49 PM CDT up reply actions
We all want love, Ross
The answer? Aliens. Or not aliens.
by Blackheartnopants on Oct 31, 2011 8:39 PM CDT up reply actions
Usually you have to pay double for that kind of action
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
Or "sense" of self-righteousness.
Apparently I also want a commenter who can type at a level slightly more proficient than a quadruple amputee.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Self of self-righteousness
is much more existential – I like it.
"Sometimes the truth gets in the way of a good story" - KF
by The Bacon Explosion on Oct 31, 2011 3:17 PM CDT up reply actions
nope, that's where you're wrong.
there can be middle ground, but you won’t allow it. I’ve also gotten sick of the same, tired excuses. I’m sick of hearing “no intensity”, “played not to lose” and “hasn’t ever changed anything.” Those are just buzzwords, too.
This
If the OP is about people dogging on me, I don’t care. In a few of these threads, we’ve dug into everybody’s points about the individual playcalling decisions, and I think I’m mostly on-board with the Angry Mob as far as being frustrating.
As said elsewhere, I don’t really know anything about football, but I knew that on-side was coming, and I was jumping up and down in my living room because we didn’t have the right coverage in, and our guys were playing WAY off the line.
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Apropos of nothing
I make my living as a change implementer. I analyze processes and make them more efficient. One of the very first things we look at are trends. When we spot a trend heading outside of the standard deviation, we dissect what the root cause is and implement new procedures in order get the results to fall within a tighter deviation.
What I’m trying to say is this: Iowa football has a trend of fucking football games up the same exact way. We all can surmise that the players aren’t going rogue and calling the plays themselves. This is a trend. To ignore the trend is to stick your head in the sand and pray that things get better when the more logical person would attempt to correct it.
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions
It is a disturbing trend
But KF will do what he does until it works again. And we all have to enjoy (or not) the ride. I stopped caring about basketball because of Lickliter, I’m almost there wit h Ferentz. I’m sick of hearing about recruiting issues, lack of execution, being surprised by trick plays, etc. Lack of execution is a trend, but to me lack of execution means two things we have bad players or the coaches aren’t coaching up the players. However, we have so many guys in the NFL which one is it?
As others have stated
Developing players into NFL players isn’t even close to pregame planning and in-game management. If there was a championship of NFL development, Kirk would be a College Football Hall of Famer by now.
I believe in the talent of most players on the squad. What bothers me is that I’m finding it more difficult to believe in the coaches’ ability to take what they’ve developed and make it work within the span of a game.
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions
We're on the same page
We don’t really have an offensive philosophy other than we are a zone team. I don’t pretend to be as knowledgeable about football as KF and his staff, but I do know enough to see that we are very easy to prepare for offensively and defensively opponents know they can personnell us to do death because we refuse to adjust.
Best case scenario Norm retires, KOK gets an HC job and KF goes out of his comfort level and hires guys that know how to get the most out of their players, whatever those players may have
You can wait it out with me on the sidelines. We'll have mojitos!
I spent half my life's earnings on wine, women & song. The other half I wasted.
by therealCatnuts on Oct 31, 2011 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions
Sweet Jeepus, do I love mojitos
Is that a foo-foo drink? I don’t care.
The answer? Aliens. Or not aliens.
by Blackheartnopants on Oct 31, 2011 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions
well i dont really like..
whatever.. pour me one.
He sired a baseball team... An orchestra, if you count the bastards!
by SaturdayMorningKegStanzis on Oct 31, 2011 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions
An actual Ferentz quote
From the post-game:
"Our effort was really lacking and theirs wasn’t. Today, they outplayed us in all three phases, but I don’t think it was a lack of effort on our part."
What is this I don’t even.
"You start to get out of bed, you say, 'Oh, [expletive], I only got one leg on, I better get the other leg on.'" -- Norm Parker
It is the perfect non-answer answer
It is vague, self-contradictory, blame-shifting and doesn’t answer the actual question asked. In other words, it is the perfectly distilled essence of Kirk Ferentz.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
by HoyaGoon on Oct 31, 2011 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I really hope he just misspoke and meant to say execution in the first part
because, otherwise…ouch.
by Iowa Refugee on Oct 31, 2011 12:05 PM CDT up reply actions
One thing that was somewhat amazing, and I don't know if this was shown on TV,
when the Gophers were coming back in the 4Q and TCF started to rock, the Minnesota sideline was actually dancing with the PA music. There was definitely an enthusiasm gap in this, like most, recent games.
Understand, Kill is so old-school he makes Ferentz seem like MTV. The Minnesota sideline was dancing with the music.
We play tackle football.
There were several shots
of the Minnesota sidelines dancing and being excited and acting like the game was kind of important to them and they wanted to win.
Our side, not so much.
"You start to get out of bed, you say, 'Oh, [expletive], I only got one leg on, I better get the other leg on.'" -- Norm Parker
Their bench literally looked like the Wisconsin student section during "Jump Around"
And they were waving towels and jumping for any good play too. Kudos to them for being so excited for this game after the year they’ve had. Any kid getting the shit kicked out of them all year would probably hang his head. Not every coach could prevent them from doing so.
"I know you're from Middle America, and sometimes you feel like you're representing more than just a school or a conference, maybe an entire group of American citizens out there."
by Twin Cities Hawk on Oct 31, 2011 12:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Good, it was fun to see.
I’ve been a supporter of Kill all along, and I was glad, that if we have to lose, we at least lost to a good guy.
If you replay this game, he had to do several things, and he did them all.
a. get lucky. (He got lucky because they couldn’t stop the run, but we forgot to run. He got lucky on our field goals.)
b. make big plays. (They made half a dozen big plays.)
c. put the game in his best player’s hands, if they got close (Gray, check.)
d. obligatory special teams surprise (Four against White, onsides, check.)
e. get Gray’s best passing game ever (Gray made how many bad passes? One?)
So everything had to go their way, but they had a clear, high-variance game plan, they stayed in the game emotionally, and then … they dominated mentally. Our guys freaked out in our last series. Credit to Kill. It’s not going to be easier against his teams next year and thereafter.
We play tackle football.
Sorry to cross the sports streams here ...
But in baseball, the manager has to have the pulse of the clubhouse. Do they work best as a bunch of rowdy guys? Go with it. Are they lunchpail, no frills guys? Go with it.
Minny’s guys wanted have some fun, so Kill went with it. He may have encouraged it.
And Iowa …?
The answer? Aliens. Or not aliens.
by Blackheartnopants on Oct 31, 2011 12:20 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, why weren't we dancing around on the sidelines...
after we just lost an onside kick and puked all over ourselves?
by TangerinePony on Oct 31, 2011 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions
I saw it
I was clowning on Royston(#3) during the game because pretty much the entire game he was being abused by Coker, he must of been run over about 5 times, but there he was in the 4th quarter jumping up and down, firing up the crowd and his teammates…on our sideline guys looked shell shocked.
Ferentz is talking about two games here...
… last year’s loss and this past weekend.
The first sentence is in response to the 2010 game and “today” obviously means this year’s installment of “Unfathomable Hawkeye Loss.”
Well I for one am fully behind Our Good Captain as head coach of our Beloved Hawkeyes
He’s the man for us and the perfect for for Iowa, and is a good leader for Our Boys. I know he’s one of the best coaches in the country and will right this ship! Sure there will be hiccups here and there but with Kirk Ferentz we know things will be done The Right Way and our Hawkeyes will be back to their winning ways before you know it! The Good Captain has forgotten more football than any of us will ever know (same goes for Norm & KOK), and really, who are we to question that? Just lazy, drunk armchair quarterbacks who abandon ship at the first little sign of trouble, that’s who!
Well not me! I’m behind Coach Ferentz and Our Boys 110%! Go Hawkeyes!
by DRUGS on Oct 31, 2011 12:16 PM CDT reply actions 5 recs
Not believable. Too much correct usage of punctuation.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Probably BOC.
That guy is a nerd.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions
Nah that ain't me man, I'm from Buffalo.
"Pursue happiness... with diligence."
by Bucketochicken on Oct 31, 2011 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions
A rec for you, sir
Don’t go spending that on… oh fuck it. Smoke em if you got em.
I will haunt your dreams and eat your children.
I could really go for some of you right now, DRUGS
Anything to ease the pain and suffering. Maybe I’ll have some of you for next Saturday. If I’m tripping balls Saturday morning, I’ll probably just watch cartoons instead of the slaughter Meetchicken is going to put on this defense.
Yes, fire Kirk
I use to ‘member a coach name Tom Davis and he was ok like, but not enough, so let’s get sumone take us to the next level in BBall! Hawk Basketball #1 4-eva!
I find it interesting
that the only people who are saying “Fire Kirk” are his defenders. Ironically, of course; as they seem to believe that everyone who questions KF is tantamount to demanding his ouster immediately. I can’t speak for everyone, but I am willing to let Ferentz turn it around. I just haven’t seen any evidence to date that he will
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
the 2008-09 campaigns are the vexing data
What was the difference? I really think it boils down to Stanzi providing the rah-rah spark that the team needed to make the game fun and, after they won a few close shaves, convince everybody that they were for real and could pull this off. It’s not a huge coincidence that once he went down, they stopped winning. It’s not just that he was a good QB — JVB also acquitted himself respectably at OSU, the defacto B1G championship game that year.
And we lost, in OT. You have to think that Stanzi, playing in OT in that situation, would have won that game, not because he’s a better QB skillwise, necessarily, but because he brought that intangible to the team.
JVB is not that leader. Who is? Apparently nobody, now.
So here’s the hypothetical — if you subtract Stanzi from the 2008-2009 team, I think you’re looking at losses to, at a minimum, MSU and Indiana, and quite possibly Michigan and/or Arkansas State. Suddenly it’s another mediocre season, adding to a string of them that date back to The Catch.
And if that’s the situation, you have to ask if Ferentz basically caught lightning in a bottle for three seasons with a ridiculously over-achieving class of kids, and lost his touch thereafter.
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions
2008 is really weird
I think that team was far better than 2009, but we didn’t play up to that level. Plus, we got really fucking lucky, A LOT, in 2009. The early season QB issues certainly hindered us in 2008. And I don’t think we necessarily go undefeated, but we should have beaten at least 2 out of Pitt, Northwestern and Illinois. MSU was a toss up.
And it wasn’t necessarily Stanzi who was the leader, at least the overly-vocal emotional leader. You had King in 2008 and Angerer/Edds in 2009. Not that Stanzi wasn’t, just that he was hardly the only leader. And that leads to another issue I have with Ferentz. It’s become clear that he won’t be the one to provide the spark if its missing, that he expects someone on the team to step up and do it. That’s fine when someone does, but in the absence of that, it IS up to Ferentz to provide that lift. That’s the price of leadership.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
Had Stanzi started all of 2008
who knows what would have happened.
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
Agree on '08.
They were like a lite version of USC in ‘02; a team with several early season losses who started firing on all cylinders late in the year. By the end of that season I don’t know of more than a few teams who would have felt comfortable on the same field as Iowa.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Oct 31, 2011 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions
I think if you take stanzi out of his 3 years of playing..
Nevermind, I dont want to think about it.
by The KF Karate Chop on Oct 31, 2011 1:05 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Davis + Less of A Prick + Less Overpaid + Better Winning Percentage (?) = Still Fired
Kirk + Total Prick + Incredibly Overpaid + Ability To Make Me Angry By Chewing Gum = F if I know
by Billy Happel's Soft But Manly Hands on Oct 31, 2011 2:44 PM CDT up reply actions
You haven't seen evidence of Kirk turning a program around?
OK, peace treaty HoyaGoon (not bc I like you but because I have to go back to work). I will admit that if said trend of the last two years continues for another year or two, then we can talk about canning Ferentz.
Why can't we just can the coordinators?
What’s wrong with talking about that? Everyone says that Kirk has KOK and Norm because they run the offense and defense he likes to run so basically they’re immune from firing.
Yeah, because we can’t find another coordinator who doesn’t utilize a conservative pro-style offense or one that runs the base 4-3 every fucking down.
Whoa. Iowa as Illinois?
Are the economics similar, even with the disparity between Kirk & Zook’s salaries? Illinois couldn’t afford to fire Zook, but could afford to hire new coordinators, right? When does Kirk’s current contract end? Is the Iowa athletic department in similar condition; or, if bringing new blood into the coordinator ranks, would it just be more economical (irrespective of all the attenuating operational dysfunction) to just eat Kirk’s whole contract and get new blood at all three positions?
Just forget it. Not happening.
Might as well discuss the sun exploding. There’s no point.
We play tackle football.
This is how I feel about talk of firing JoePa
Never would’ve brought it up if not for Mike’s inquiry.
On a related note, there is only so much hydrogen left in the sun.
by jtothep on Oct 31, 2011 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
THE SUN IS NOT GOING TO EXPLODE
Its too small. Its outer layers will expand as it moves into a helium-burning phase in about a billion years, which requires a higher temperature at the core, and the Sun’s outer layers will probably expand to about Mars’ orbit as the Sun goes into its red giant phase, consuming Mercury, Venus, the Earth, and Mars… but, on the upside, it will probably be warm enough to create slug like life on one of the Galilean moons of Jupiter or maybe even Triton orbiting Saturn.
Never *question* Bruce Dickinson!
http://www.thebirdcult.net
by The Bird Cult on Oct 31, 2011 5:56 PM CDT up reply actions
Easy there
Much like the Chicago Bears, hiring new coordinators can only mask incompetence for so long. Zooker is an incompetent coach, Kirk Ferentz is not.
The thing that I have trouble with is that everyone is clamoring for the current staff to “change” things or adjust when it’s been clear that they haven’t and never will. They’ll always fall back in their old ways. It was sort of like the no huddle offense. It didn’t work for for a couple drives and suddenly that part of the playbook is sent to a black site never to be heard from again. Was it the right thing to do? Debatable. Regardless, it illustrates the point that when Iowa does change or try something new it doesn’t last. So for everyone to expect changes to happen in philosophy when we’re using the same staff that has shown the inability to do something different is the equivalent of wanting to have your cake and eat it too.
Never happen.
Friendship and relationships matter more to Ferentz than politics.
We play tackle football.
Yes, I have seen evidence of it
Unfortunately, that evidence is 10 years old.
I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.
Losing to Minnesota might be excusable....
…if Iowa were coached by YMCA volunteers.
And the team was comprised entirely of foreign exchange students who don’t understand Football.
And if they were all terminal Make-A-Wish kids.
But even then, I would expect them to cover the spread vs. the Gophers.
The Takeaway Made Me Burn My Computer. I Am Typing Through The Flames.
by Billy Happel's Soft But Manly Hands on Oct 31, 2011 2:38 PM CDT reply actions
so much for soft but manly hands
"Sometimes the truth gets in the way of a good story" - KF
by The Bacon Explosion on Oct 31, 2011 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions
A few comments from one of your more mature (read: older) readers.
Iowa has had two very successful FB coaches in a row, KF and Fry. Since 1979 we have had great coaches. No reason to expect if KF goes we will suddenly get a dud.
For approx. $4 million/year, we could hire nearly any college FB coach we wanted and win. The idea that we couldn’t is absurd. We could easily hire a “destination” coach who would attract recruits. We are not only willing to put our money where our mouth is, we already HAVE.
How much we pay KF does matter, at some point. We pay him $4 million/year, yet some people think we deserve only $1 million/yr expectations. That does not compute. KF is paid that much to not only win games, but fire ineffective staff when he has to. So far, he hasn’t fired a single person, to my knowledge.
College FB is rapidly advancing. Back in 1999, Iowa faced one or two mobile QB’s. This year, there are only a few Big Ten teams with true NFL-style QBs: Iowa, MSU, and PSU. Yet our defense seems designed to stop only that kind of QB. QBs are light-years better than they used to be in college, and all you had to do was look at the NFL yesterday to see that: a bunch of rookie QBs started, and most did pretty well. That’s not how it was in 1999.
Team chemistry is different than in 1999. The players want to work hard and win, but they also want to have fun doing it. You have some players for five years, and some for only two before they bolt to The League. Some you have for all of three months before they get “homesick” and bolt for another college, perhaps not even one close to home. The old saying “My way or the highway” may not be as applicable today as it was in the Eisenhower Administration. You have to maintain discipline, but you also have to make players WANT to have the Iowa Football Experience. Losing to teams like Minnesota while playing a non-aggressive defense, playing not-to-lose with a lose-able lead, may not be the best way to do that. Did you see their sideline in the fourth quarter? Did you see ours?
Life would be great if all you had to do was show up and cash your paycheck, and nothing in your line of work ever changed, and you never had to find a new paradigm, and you never had to fire ineffective workers, and you never had to stand up and take criticism, and smile when you do it. A guy making minimum wage at McDonald’s isn’t expected to have to do that. A guy making $4 million bucks a year? When that money is somehwat voluntarily given in an uncertain economic environment? When ticket prices have doubled in 10 years, and when seat licenses have been bought and paid for?
That guy needs to understand that the expectations for his job are a little more than he perhaps thinks they are. Honestly, I’d wager that there are not many truly elite programs who would still be employing that person. As much as we always say “We’re so lucky to have him!”, perhaps it’s his time to realize “Man, I’m so lucky to have THEM!”
Coach, make the changes that need to be made. The villagers are gathering, torches are being lit, and I think I saw that pitchforks just went on sale.
"Apparently, riding Joe Paterno like a small horse is FROWNED UPON IN THIS ESTABLISHMENT!"
by The Director on Oct 31, 2011 4:13 PM CDT reply actions 16 recs
This is why the "number of people in teh NFL stat izzs stooopid" mantra doesn't make sense to me
We need players to want to come to Iowa, yet nobody cares how many players we send to the pros? Is nobody else aware that REALLY GOOD prospects coming to play college football are looking to turn into NFL players, and if your school is not producing any NFL talent, they’ll overlook you? The fact that Iowa sends lots of kids to the NFL is a huge recruiting point for talent.
The obvious follow-up question is, “where are the fruits of that statistic and why aren’t they winning games?” The answer, see the rest of this thread.
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 7:02 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree with a lot of that, but there are some pretty big assumptions in there...
Iowa has had two very successful FB coaches in a row, KF and Fry. Since 1979 we have had great coaches. No reason to expect if KF goes we will suddenly get a dud.
And there’s also zero reason to expect that we will suddenly hit another home run, based on a preposterouly small sample size of… two coaches. Plenty of programs have made missteps when it comes to hiring new coaches and I don’t see why Iowa is somehow immune to that. Even Iowa hasn’t been immune to making missteps in hiring (albeit in other sports). I think Barta’s track record is mostly solid — he’s improved some of the non-revenue sports and Fran is hitting all the right notes in everything but winning games (coming soon, hopefully). The Lickliter hiring was a disaster, though.
I don’t think fear of hiring a dud is a reason NOT to fire Ferentz, but I think it’s a relevant factor to consider when you’re considering the total situation. The assumption that Iowa will go 3-for-3 in hiring new football coaches is just that — an assumption. It’s not — by any means — a guarantee.
For approx. $4 million/year, we could hire nearly any college FB coach we wanted and win. The idea that we couldn’t is absurd. We could easily hire a "destination" coach who would attract recruits. We are not only willing to put our money where our mouth is, we already HAVE.
This implies that a new head coach at Iowa would start at $4m/yr (or even the $3.6m/yr that Ferentz is at now), which I don’t think is a lock. Ferentz reached that level by winning Big Ten titles and taking Iowa to BCS bowls (and, yes, playing off reported NFL interest), but he certainly didn’t start off there. Iowa would probably only pay that much to a very small group of established coaches: Bob Stoops if he wanted to come “home,” Urban Meyer if he decided Iowa City was a swell place to live, etc.
"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"
by RossWB on Oct 31, 2011 8:26 PM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
Yes, they are big assumptions.
But they are also assumptions based somewhat on prior experience: since 1978 Iowa has had two football coaches, two very good ones, and that’s 33 years ago! That stat by itself speaks well of what kind of job and stability a new coach might expect. That’s incredibly desirable, as are the fans of the Iowa, and as is the potential salary. I am confident we would get a name coach if we wanted, and I am confident that coach would succeed. There’s no guarantee, but our last three decades would suggest that a) you can rebuild a great team at Iowa, b) you can reasonably be competitive at Iowa, c) you can fill the stands at Kinnick, and d) you can make a shit-load of money at Iowa. I like those odds.
I think it is entirely possible that our next coach could start at $3 million+ at Iowa. When Ferentz came to Iowa, he immediately exceeded Hayden’s salary, I recall. Maybe we go small—highly thought of MAC guy—but I don’t think so. I think we’d go reasonably big—poaching from a team like Boise St, or a hot coordinator—and pay that guy $2 million or more right off the bat. Do you see teams like IU or Minny or ISU doing that? I don’t. We’ve got more to offer. That’s why I’m rather confident about this.
"Apparently, riding Joe Paterno like a small horse is FROWNED UPON IN THIS ESTABLISHMENT!"
by The Director on Oct 31, 2011 8:49 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think we can poach a name coach.
We’re not an elite destination, we’re just a pretty darn good one. We could grab a coordinator from an elite, but if we want to steal a coach it’s either from a mid-major or a Duke/Vandy type school.
But if a Stoops or Meyer called Barta and said $5,000,000, bloodpunch would probably tear his rotator cuff whipping out the checkbook.
"If you need a rah-rah speech at halftime, you’re playing the wrong sport." - Pat Angerer
Kirk Ferentz is your coach for at least the end of his contract
and I will stand by that even if he loses out and there is no bowl, then wins 5 or 6 games next year.
The only way this changes is if Kinnick becomes a graveyard overnight. By that I mean 56K a game type drop off. Not happening. This type of security is possibly one of KF’s issues. He was a different coach 8 years ago.
"I wish you luck with a capital 'F'" - The Real Elvis.
Yeah, pretty much.
The only way anything changes is if attendance at Kinnick drops precipitously and/or if the money from big money donors stops coming in. Money talks and for now Iowa is still pulling in a ton of money, results be damned.
"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"
The sun's not going to explode either.
We’d need to see multiple years of fan rejection and bowl no-shows for this even to be a reasonable possibility. I think discussions of KF getting fired push the boundary between the hypothetical and absurd.
BTW, we could get to six wins, but it would require an upset. And that is with the easiest schedule we’re going to see for years.
My view is that despite the loss of practice time, this program needs to spend December doing nothing but staring in the mirror. They are prisoners of their carefully calibrated process. In this respect beating Missouri last year could appear to distract management (coaches) from absorbing the lessons of 2010. Last year was the one year in five when we have the talent and experience to be elite.
We play tackle football.
Honestly, I have no idea who Iowa could or would get.
I was kind of surprised that Michigan wound up with Brady Hoke. I thought they would be able to land someone bigger. I think they got a good coach in Hoke, but he wasn’t exactly a big fish with former HC gigs at Ball State and San Diego State.
And Indiana did somehow grab Kevin Wilson from Oklahoma (for $1.2M), so yeah — Iowa could probably do that. Would that be a good move or not? I dunno.
And, yeah, there are a lot of reasons why a new coach could be successful at Iowa, but the same could have been said of RichRod at Michigan or Ron Zook at Florida (to name just a few examples)… and that didn’t happen.
"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"
I think George Costanza would say that Hoke is a big fish...
But I tend to agree with you on the sample size. Not only was Ferentz not a “home run” at the time of his hiring (Hell, people were angry he was hired) but Fry was more or less an unknown. It’s easy to think of him as a legend now but the reality is that in an era that didn’t have sports-only channels and 24 hour coverage of recruiting and the like, Fry was a bit of a “huh?” hire as well. After all, it’s not like we hired Darrel K. Royal or Johnny Majors.
I’d love to think that whoever the next coach of Iowa is (and I for one hope that isn’t for a while yet) will be another smashing success but hiring a coach is hardly a science. Todd Lickliter by all indications should have been a great hire. As it turns out, it is hard to imagine a worse hire (ask SMA for details, I think he’s on vol. 5 of his “Chronicles of Todd” series).
I do find myself on the side that believes changes on the staff need to be made. However, I still believe (for now) that Kirk Ferentz is the right man to lead this program. If we’re having this same debate a year from now, though…
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Nov 1, 2011 3:47 AM CDT up reply actions
Just to make it clear....
….I do NOT want KF to be fired. I just want him to change with the times. As for any future possible replacement, my point is that we have certain advantages other programs do not have—I’d consider Iowa a top 20 college FB job—so I am confident we could, and would, be able to find a very good coach in the event KF leaves at some point.
Some people act as if we’re little ole Iowa and nobody likes us and nobody would EVER want to come here who’s famous or any good—but that’s simply not true. The fact that we’re paying a coach (who averages 8-4 seasons) all of $3.6 million/yr would attract a lot of potential coaches.
"Apparently, riding Joe Paterno like a small horse is FROWNED UPON IN THIS ESTABLISHMENT!"
It's all Monopoly money
None of it comes from the general budget. It doesn’t matter what they spend on their coach. Similiar to the costs for travel during a bowl game. They are good at bringing their costs just under what they earn.
I know that the contract figure being public info makes it fodder for comparison between schools/coaches, however, what the U of I decides to pay their coach doesn’t effect anyone besides the coach.
by Vandy's Mom Digs Me on Oct 31, 2011 9:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Here's the money shot:
Life would be great if all you had to do was show up and cash your paycheck, and nothing in your line of work ever changed, and you never had to find a new paradigm, and you never had to fire ineffective workers, and you never had to stand up and take criticism, and smile when you do it. A guy making minimum wage at McDonald’s isn’t expected to have to do that. A guy making $4 million bucks a year?
When I reflect on my work week, and then see crap like what we saw on the field Saturday, it makes me think that perhaps I’m better at my job than KF is at his.
And I’m doing pretty well, but regrettably no where near $3.6M.
Is it out of vogue...
To complain about officials? I thought in the 4th and 1 “spot” we got about as screwed by the ref as we did in that “offsides onside kick” against FLA several bowls ago. Up to that point we were struggling, but completely in control. The O was racking up yards, if not points, hogging the ball, and having their way. The D was actually getting 3-and-outs, and forcing failed 4th down conversions. Should we have been up 35-10? Yes. Should that poor spot have mattered? No. But we were struggling on the road, being stupid, etc. and the refs gave them a nice shot of adrenaline and coincidentally sucked all the life out of our D. We never really got the ball back until it was to late (for VDB, not Stanzi, of course). And Kirk’s hands were tied due to his already used coaches challenge (which I also thought was a shit call—the replay guys must have been asleep all game).
Were there mistakes? Absolutely. Should we cry about our pig? Yes. Should we assume this team and these coaches can no longer win a game? That’s crazy. We’ll beat Michigan or Michigan State, probably Purdue, and perhaps Nebraska.
This performance wasn’t as bad as the Penn State one.
It wasn't too late for Vandy
We needed 50 yards, had plenty of time, and MN was going to be in super-coverage mode. And, oh year, our RB and FB were simply having their way with the defense all game. That last series was full of LOL. Bad flashback time.
I agree the officiating was especially bad, but
its not what cost us the game. That 4th down spot and “completed” pass was total bullshit. But the officials didn’t stop us from continuing to run the ball or taking the opportunity to go for scores with time remaining.
It was obvious Kill didn’t want our passing attack, namely McNutt to beat them. He was gambling that our run game wasn’t going to win us the game. He made us a one dimensional team…and our one dimension was absolutely MURDERING them, but for some reason we didn’t capitalize…and he gambled right.
agree but no excuse
Everybody gets burned by shitty officiating, and for every burn, you win one. Ask Mizzou fans how they felt about the 4th down non-catch in last year’s Insight Bowl. Ask Indiana about phantom touchdowns vs Iowa. They have horror stories, we just don’t remember them that way.
Kids get hurt.
Officials blow calls.
Guys leave the program.
QBs have bad days.
Yet, somehow, Ohio State won, what, 5 or 6 straight championships? They have all those bounces, too.
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
by hawkeyeinstl on Oct 31, 2011 7:04 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I agree about the Mizzou call.
I think we got a bit of a gift there. But I disagree about the IU calls—I think those were the correct calls. I remember looking at those plays multiple times, and I think those were gotten right.
However, I do believe that 4th and 1 call was bullcrap and potentially kind of cost us the game.
"Apparently, riding Joe Paterno like a small horse is FROWNED UPON IN THIS ESTABLISHMENT!"
by The Director on Oct 31, 2011 8:55 PM CDT up reply actions
The Mizzou guy for sure didnt catch it, slid out of bounds first
by clay-born to party on Oct 31, 2011 9:13 PM CDT up reply actions
Er, no, we got a gift.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Nov 1, 2011 3:49 AM CDT up reply actions
Retracted.
I watched that game on 1 & 1/2 hours of sleep, as the in-game thread would show.
Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.
by Kyle McCann't on Nov 2, 2011 12:55 AM CDT up reply actions
Yeah there's really no doubt that hit the ground
We got a gift when Gabbert threw his second bad pass of the day.
I agree
The Mizzou call was right. I live amongst Mizzou fans, trust me, I heard about it for days afterwards. But the point is that everybody thinks they have bad calls that go against them, and sometimes they’re right, and you can’t say, “oh, well we got a bad call, that’s why we lost.”
There’s always an excuse to explain any loss, the question is what are you doing to over come things beyond your control? SOMEBODY will probably go undefeated this year, and Iowa has been tantalizingly close to being that somebody for FOUR STRAIGHT YEARS, including this year. Just one play, just one thing done differently in each of those games, and Iowa could be undefeated since the 2007 season, we’ve been that close to winning in every single one of our games.
Name one other college team that can say that. This team is good, this coaching staff is good. What’s frustrating is that when you look at the body of evidence, we could be more than just good – we could be outstanding – and we’re not. Y por que no?!
A man may leave Iowa, but Iowa never leaves a man.
I'm glad I was visiting my brother and his wife and newborn daughter Saturday
I watched the game, but while I normally would have been in a shitty mood the rest of the day, I had other things on my mind.
That said, this loss probably pisses me off more than any other. Almost every ISU loss, I can say “well, they won their Super Bowl” (and it’s true more often than not) – and something similar for many of the jNW losses. Last year’s Minny loss I have come to accept was a team that had completely given up. But this Minnesota team is so inexplicably bad, I could not possibly envision any way we would lose this game. And with the way we were moving the ball, I didn’t see how we weren’t winning by more. But fuck me, that is an awful Minnesota team.
In any event, I don’t know what to make of all of it. I sure as shit don’t want Ferentz fired, but I also understand the criticisms of he and the staff. And I will also admit that I am generally very slow to want to fire coaches. Hell, I was all for giving Lick one more year to try to see improvement (but I am now glad we made the move – I love what Fran is doing).
For those who don’t give a shit about how many we send to the NFL, well, I don’t know what to tell you, because it’s a big fucking deal. It should be a source of pride to know that our team and staff can produce top-level players when not always working with top-level athletes. (And yes, I too would like to see that manifest itself as victories as well).
I think more than anything I want to get back to being the “Bullies of the Big Ten.” At the very least, even if we don’t necessarily win, teams know they’re gonna go home hurting for a few days. Unfortunately, especially on the defensive side, I don’t see how that happens any time soon.
"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe
See, I kind of disagree, in that we COULD be playing harder and hitting harder - its all about ATTITUDE
I think most Iowa fans would be, well, maybe not OK, with continuing to lose IF the team was playing hard and trying. What they see is a team that’s not playing hard and trying.
Look, if you can’t slow the other team’s offense down, at least HIT them hard when you finally do tackle them. Make them earn the goddamned points. We don’t need conditioning or better players, football is a very simple game. Kick the other guy across from you on the line of scrimmage’s ass for 60 regulation minutes, and generally, if you don’t win the other team will be glad that they got out of there with a win.
So much of this is actually easily fixable, but the change has to come from the top down. We need to start acting like an 0-11 team that is mad as hell and doesn’t want to take it anymore. Bring the wood, bring the attitude, take some names and rip some body parts off.
And Ferentz needs to start doing some screaming because I honestly do not think the big money boosters are going to put up with this for very much longer. They pulled the plug on Lick pretty fast, and this is quickly degenerating into a Lick style situation. Right now, we’ve got a situation at Iowa where a coaching regime change isn’t going so much to have to rebuild as bring in a fresh attitude and approach to Iowa. The players are there, but they won’t be if this continues another 2-3 years.
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by The Bird Cult on Oct 31, 2011 11:11 PM CDT up reply actions
We don’t need conditioning or better players, football is a very simple game. Kick the other guy across from you on the line of scrimmage’s ass for 60 regulation minutes,
It’s nice in theory, but you DO need better players. Or at least better ones than we’ve got. Our DL is horrible. And no amount of “try hard” will fix that. On the other hand, the tackling (by everyone) has been almost vomit-inducing.
How about something even simpler – powerlifting. Just lift something heavy, right? But no amount of ATTITUDE and TRY HARD is going to change the fact that I can’t deadlift 700 pounds. I’m not saying a little more fire would hurt us, but it sure as shit isn’t gonna solve everything.
"There are few things graven in stone, except that you have to squat or you're a pussy." -Mark Rippetoe
I thought it was KF's specialty to turn sub-par nobodies into good if not great players.
But now suddenly our players aren’t good enough and that’s not KF’s fault? He’s the one in charge of the recruiting. He’s the one that’s supposed to be teaching the players how to improve their game. He’s the one that’s responsible for creating an atmosphere that makes kids want to come to Iowa. He decides who plays on which plays. He’s the one that’s supposed to be in charge of pretty much every facet of Iowa football, so he has to have a large share of the responsibility for the state of the team right now. The majority of the team (not walk-ons) are playing at Iowa because they were asked to play there. It’s KF’s job to MAKE them better players once they get there, and if he’s not recruiting guys with the potential to get better than something is wrong.
And please, don’t tell me “We’re just Iowa” and “Nobody wants to come to a boring state full of corn.” Ask the Husker fans how that works out for them. Their freaking mascot is corn!
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