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On Iowa conduct

I am likely asking for trouble but I have often wondered about the arrests, DUI's, public intoxication, etc. that seem to have followed the two major programs at Iowa for over a decade now.  Growing up in the Chicago area, I had siblings and friends that ended up at schools all over the Big Ten, Missouiri Valley, MAC and OVC and I was able to visit many of them at one point or another.  The culture and behavior at these schools, while not entirely uniform, was still more similar than not.  Why are there seemingly so many more legal problems for Iowa athletes than at these schools?

I have heard stories about how when players under Hayden were picked up by IC police that they were driven straight to his house rather than the police department.  After Fry "redirected" the young men in question, they were allowed to go home and avoid the negative publicity while also having the fear of God put into them.  I don't know if that's the stuff of Iowa legend and I also don't know if I advocate skirting legal protocol, but it would certainly explain the increase in reported incidences after he left.  Under Alford, it was easy to see his slick, disingenuous demeanor and translate it into a culture of poor character recruits, but that has also continued to a degree under Likcliter.  I have also often heard about the "boredom" factor of Iowa City, and Madison it is not.  However, Urbana-Champaign, West Lafayette, Bloomington or East Lansing (to name a few) are hardly overflowing with points of interest for young athletes.

OK, so the nature of my (ahem) logic is scattershot at best and this post has clearly devolved into a state rambling at this point, but I guess my larger question is this; do Iowa City police and (for the most part) University of Iowa officials just not turn the blind eye to their student athletes' behavior that authorities on other campuses do?  Is it possible that because the "old guard" of Fry and Davis are gone, past "understandings" with law enforcement have gone by the wayside?  Am I just grasping at straws?  Theories, facts and mockery are welcomed.

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I have no "inside" knowledge about Iowa City.

However, a few influences on this issue that I would consider would include:

A lot of negative publicity was given to schools like Miami FL, Oklahoma, and others in the late 1980s and early 1990s regarding the behaviors of their athletes (especially their football players). I am not saying that Iowa ever really approached the criminal status of “The U” and its ’Canes. But, I also think that many people in the media (and perhaps also in law enforcement) decided that the “blind eye and let the coach handle it” method might only enable these young, aggressive men to wreak havoc on their communities. They wanted to avoid a situation like the one at Miami FL.

Another thing is there is more accountability in law enforcement now. I have never really been one to question the police or the sheriff’s office. However, with every squad car now having a camera, and every media outlet willing to ask questions (or file the proper paperwork to get their questions answered), you now have lessened ability for things to happen “quietly.” Can you imagine the uproar that would happen now if the Press-Citizen found out that Anthony Tucker was found passed out, but was driven to Lickliter’s house to sleep it off? Lick might have been fired within 1 year instead of 4. (LOL)

Also, you probably have more student/community organizations and movements (some religious, many not) that are now willing to confront these types of issues.

On this next point, I’m not sure if the statistics would show it or not, but I would have to think that alcohol and drug use (and abuse) has probably trended upward for college students since roughly 1960 or 1965. (There may be occasional steps downward, and we may now be trending back down a bit). I may be wrong, and I don’t want to take the time to research this point, so anyone that wants to can feel free to provide opposing information.

I can’t be sure that major universities have become more liberal (although I’m sure there are many people who would say yes). Yet, it seems as though the decision-makers in them probably have become more liberal (probably partly a function of less employment discrimination at those levels). Therefore, you probably have less people in power that will kow-tow to football coaches and the boosters who back those coaches, especially if it comes to serious issues like assaults and other violent crimes.

Finally, we now live in a world where anybody with a cell phone or a computer can capture and publish news. If I see a somewhat notable athlete like Anthony Tucker passed out in an alley, and if I am more concerned with my own importance than I am with his well-being, I can snap a photo of him sitting against the brick wall. I can call the cops right then and there, and then I can go home and blog about it. Or, if I am a cab driver, I can lock the doors and call the cops right away.

On the one hand, the conservative in me wants to say that it was better for my favorite football team in terms of publicity and player eligibility back in the “good old days.” However, there is also a part of me that is a brother of sisters and a part of me that likes to consider myself a decent human being. That part of me is glad that athletes will be held to a level of accountability (at least) that the average student is held to. That part of me is glad that universities and colleges appear to be taking steps to avoid drunkenness and rapes, or at the very least allow the legal system to provide appropriate negative sanctions.

/end rant.

I've sentenced boys younger than you to the gas chamber. Didn't want to do it. I felt I owed it to them.

-- Judge Smails

by WaterlooChazz on Feb 14, 2010 1:02 PM CST reply actions  

I guess my only problem with this response

is that it addresses this behavior on a national level, not as it applies to Iowa specifically. There are other campuses (Penn State comes to mind) that have dealt with more than their fair share of player indiscretions, but I guess I’m asking why we don’t see it on a larger scale from campus to campus. Is it that these two towns breed misbehavior or are other environments more permissive of the athlete double standard?

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Feb 14, 2010 1:22 PM CST up reply actions  

But part of that is what you choose to focus your attention on.

Like, when Iowa had a walk-on punter get busted for a DUI about 4-5 years ago, it was on the front page of the ICPC. It was not, however, on ESPN. So a Penn State fan would have never known about it, even though Iowa fans would rightly think that there was an inordinate amount of attention being paid to the situation. So if PSU (or Random Major School X) had a walk-on get nailed for drunk driving tomorrow, and it was splashed onto the front page of the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette (or Random Major Local Paper Y), but ESPN didn’t pick it up… would you know about it?

I got more rhymes than Wade Lookingbill's got dunks

by Adam Jacobi on Feb 14, 2010 1:32 PM CST up reply actions  

I considered this point

and to an extent, there’s probably a good deal of truth to it. However, just from reading the various ESPN blogs I still see Iowa legal problems way more than at other schools. Now, this simply could come from a place where (like Miami in the 80’s), a rash of serious trouble over a short period of time led to a magnification of even the smallest incidents thereafter because they all easily fell under the broad heading of “lack of institutional control.”

Really, the Tucker thing is likely just an example of a young man that still has a lot of growing up to do and should not be seen as an indictment of the athletic program on the whole. Still, as a lifelong Hawkeye, it has been difficult for me to see so much negative publicity given to a department that I always took pride in for doing things “clean”.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Feb 14, 2010 1:45 PM CST up reply actions  

I have to agree with OPS...

in that, Hawkeye sports are probably the biggest sports story in the state. And so, all local media covers it 7 times whenever something happens.

And then, as you (McCann’t) said, when we have a rash of crime as the football team did over that year or two, then national media starts to talk about it.

Add the two together, and the problem begins to look bigger than it really will be in the long run, and we start to point the finger at the IC police.

If you think about it, even people who love PSU, or Mich St., or any other Big Ten school probably have some larger city not far away to distract some of their attention. (Chicago, Pittsburgh, Detroit, Minneapolis, Indianapolis, Milwaukee.) Here in Iowa, we might care what happens in Des Moines, or we might not.

I've sentenced boys younger than you to the gas chamber. Didn't want to do it. I felt I owed it to them.

-- Judge Smails

by WaterlooChazz on Feb 14, 2010 1:55 PM CST up reply actions  

Just so I'm clear

I’m not “pointing the finger” at the IC police but rather commending them for doing their job regardless of local celebrity status. I may be jumping to conclusions, but the stories of SEC players getting in to trouble are few and far between. Is this because they all display Tebow-like purity, or because doing something to damage the local football program is career suicide?

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Feb 14, 2010 2:07 PM CST up reply actions  

I think they probably ignore/cover more up in the south.

I've sentenced boys younger than you to the gas chamber. Didn't want to do it. I felt I owed it to them.

-- Judge Smails

by WaterlooChazz on Feb 14, 2010 2:16 PM CST up reply actions  

They do, but you probably aren't encountering them quite as much if you're viewing things through a midwest/B10 prism..

Take a look through past Fulmer Cups — SEC teams are proudly on display in the top ten of many of them. Florida has the second-most all-time points (behind only our lovable neighbors to the east) and, hell, it’s named after an SEC coach for a reason…

Also, if you look at the offenses Iowa got nailed with in last year’s competition — DUI (that’d be Prater), “road raging” (Clayborn v. taxi), lots of public intxoes/PAULAs, and drunk mopeding (Calloway)… it’s (a) not the sort of lawlessness at a college campus worth getting worked up over and (b) absolutely the sort of thing that’s happening at every single other fucking campus around the country. Why are they nailed more often in IC? I think there’s a greater focus in cracking down on underage drinking (via handing out lots of PAULAs and public intox tickets, as well as DUIs when relevant) in Iowa City (especially within the last decade). You only need to look at the police blotter for Johnson County to see that they hand out a LOT of those tickets. It would be interesting to compare those figures to the numbers of the same tickets handed out in other regions.

"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"

by RossWB on Feb 14, 2010 2:26 PM CST up reply actions  

That is the best response

I could have possibly asked for. And the Fulmer Cup may now be my favorite award in all of college sports. Just one question: Can it be handcuffed to the winner for a year?

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Feb 14, 2010 2:35 PM CST up reply actions  

The Fulmer Cup is fabulous.

Although less so when Iowa is doing dumb shit to put themselves in contention for it, obviously. But the variety of offenses that college football players manage to perpetrate in the off-season is truly something to behold.

"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"

by RossWB on Feb 14, 2010 3:50 PM CST up reply actions  

The cops in IC and Coralville just have a hard on for busting people

I once got pulled over on a game day because I “didn’t stop at the stop sign long enough” – yeah, they said I stopped. I hadn’t drank at that point, so I asked to blow right away. they just want to rack up stats. From everywhere I have ever been and the stories I have heard, IC is the college town where its easiest to get busted for what happens at every college town.

by vahawk on Feb 14, 2010 3:00 PM CST up reply actions  

The IC cops

sit outside of bars and if you trip over a your shoelaces or slip on ice they assume that you’re over the limit and immediately focus on you. I’ve had friends that got a public intox ticket for nothing more than coming out of the bar at the wrong time. Having the age to get into bars in IC at 19 has been a hotly contested topic in IC for the last 8 years or so, and that contributes to the cops focusing more on alchohol related offenses.

"I shoot, I score. He shoots, I score." - Dan Gable

by ClaybornSmash on Feb 14, 2010 3:06 PM CST up reply actions  

The one and only time

I engaged in underage drinking IN a bar, I was at the Sports Column (I hate that fucking place) and the cops raided it. Luckily for me, I’m roughly the height of a bar stool and managed to escape their grasp by waiting for them to become occupied and then sitting in a women’s bathroom stall for the better part of an hour. Yes, courage and dignity are the watchwords of my life.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Feb 14, 2010 3:09 PM CST up reply actions  

although, well done for your success.

by txhawkeye on Feb 14, 2010 5:41 PM CST up reply actions  

On the other hand...

….I think I’d rather get an underage conviction than a hanging out in the women’s crapper citation.

Interesting choice you made that night, my friend!

"If you want to become a man--come to Iowa" All American IOWA LB PAT ANGERER, whose best friend is a dog.

by The Director on Feb 14, 2010 6:16 PM CST up reply actions  

Aw, hell no

I learned so much that night. Did you know that there are snacks in the women’s restroom? They have these dispensers inside of the stalls with Twizzlers, except I think the one I had was really old because it was kind of limp and soft and the whatever dye they use for those things was leaking all over my hands…

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Feb 15, 2010 3:12 AM CST up reply actions  

The cops in Lexington, VA do this too

And it isn’t like W&L or VMI are known for their athletic success/dominance. While I was at Georgetown in the mid-90s, DC was one of, if not the #1, murder city in the country, and the cops would bust a Gtown off-campus party/raid a bar for underage drinking with enough cops to take down the crack house in New Jack City. The simple fact is, in a lot of college towns, the police look at students as nothing more than revenue generators. Bust them for a relatively “minor” offense, one that involves alcohol and, most likely, only a fine. The student is understandably eager to make the problem disappear and never challenges the thin reed upon which the charge is based and so the fee is paid and the locality collects easy money.

As others have noted, Iowa athletics, especially football, is HUGE in this state and, in the absence of local pros to cover, gets widely and exhaustively reported on, making it seem like much more of an epidemic.

As to the particulars of the Iowa City police and the sea change in the way things are handled since the 80s, a couple of key facts need to mentioned. (1) In the late 80s, the drinking age was raised from 19 to 21, thus a lot more students were suddenly guilty of a crime; (2) hazing incidents at the UofI in the early 90s leading to (3) the drinking death of a student in a frat hazing incident which leads to (4) A TON of press interest/investigation into drinking at the UofI. Add them all together and you get a police force that is a lot less willing to look the other way and let “kids be kids”.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Feb 14, 2010 6:47 PM CST up reply actions  

I was there

when that freshman frat pledge died from drinking. It was the house across from Burge, used to have a volleyball court for a front yard.

He was friggin BLUE and all they did was roll him over face down. The next day he wouldn’t wake up. Somebody should have gone to jail over that one.

Anyway, this poor 18 year old kids dies, it’s all over the news and what are the frat boys doing? Playing volleyball, stereo going and drinking beer in front of the house where the dude died not 24 hours earlier. Real classy.

In 100 years, we'll all be dead.

by Flakbait on Feb 14, 2010 10:19 PM CST up reply actions  

There is no excuse

for the death of that kid and the way the frat brothers handled it. I was in no way trying to minimize it or make excuses. My only point was that things in IC changed in its aftermath (inevitable, and largely justified) and the resulting media shitstorm.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Feb 15, 2010 12:52 AM CST up reply actions  

Maybe my perception is skewed...

but it seemed like there’s been a shift from drinking at house parties to going downtown to bars, too. And it’s much easier to dole out a ton of PAULA/public intox tickets downtown when there’s hundreds of potential targets within easy reach.

"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"

by RossWB on Feb 15, 2010 1:21 AM CST up reply actions  

Greeks went dry

my freshman year. And, yes, each house kind of “adopted” their own bar which on the whole I think makes for a safer, more transparent style of debauchery (if such a thing is possible).

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Feb 15, 2010 3:04 AM CST up reply actions  

One thing to note

There are still quite a few house parties down there. I remember going to one with my friend who goes to school there. We went to Hamburg House. Good times; saw his older brother handing out the ‘refreshments’, and some guy tried to pull one over on a bunch of drunk people. “Ricky Stanzi”, he was not. There was no aura of patriotism, only sleazy lib-ed artisticism.

by Paladin58 on Feb 16, 2010 1:42 AM CST up reply actions  

I didn't think

you were trying to minimize it. It’s just one of those things that always stuck with me so I had to say something.

In 100 years, we'll all be dead.

by Flakbait on Feb 15, 2010 7:56 AM CST up reply actions  

SEC purity?

Florida has had about 30 players arrested just since Urban Meyer has been the head coach. It has been mentioned on ESPN, but never gone into significant detail. The simple answer? Winning sweeps A LOT of things under the radar.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Feb 14, 2010 6:30 PM CST up reply actions  

27 for Urban

According to today’s Fulmer Cupdate

by MP hawkfan on Feb 15, 2010 9:39 AM CST up reply actions  

The Internet

You have to remember that prior to about 95 or 2000, an athlete getting popped for a PAULA or DUI was a local story that blew over pretty quickly. If it was a big name player, or the coach’s son, it would get picked up nationally, but even then it wouldn’t stick around.

Now, any time a 3rd stringer from a BCS school gets busted pissing in the alley behind a bar, every sports site and blog can pick it up and everybody knows. Not only that but with Google you can track those old stories down forever. Before it was like “hey, didn’t he get busted once”, but nobody could really remember.

Then you get the bloggers looking for content who just won’t let some of this crap go. It’s easier to notice it all add up.

I don’t think this is a bigger problem for Iowa than it is for most others schools, but since we are focused on the Hawkeyes it seems worse to us.

In 100 years, we'll all be dead.

by Flakbait on Feb 14, 2010 1:44 PM CST reply actions  

The World Wide Webbing

is surely an additional source of bad press, as news obviously disseminates more quickly and to a wider audience. That’s a great (and obvious) point that I foolishly overlooked. Still, as a Chicagoan I get a lot of Big Ten news filtered through my local media outlets and still see the negative press on Iowa and Penn State pop up far more regularly than the other 9 members. Again, this could be coming from a place where it’s easier for a writer to make a story out of it when it comes from those two places due to prior transgressions. Who knows, I’m probably just paranoid.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Feb 14, 2010 1:52 PM CST up reply actions  

Excellent point, Flakbait.

I forgot about how that information stays around forever, also.

I've sentenced boys younger than you to the gas chamber. Didn't want to do it. I felt I owed it to them.

-- Judge Smails

by WaterlooChazz on Feb 14, 2010 1:57 PM CST up reply actions  

Michigan State

Michigan State has arguably more problems than either Iowa or OSU. Remember Jeff Smoker? This year they’ve had tons of problems , i think they had a player that was allowed back after being in jail this season. Then they had the fight(s) and multiple people kicked off the team.

USA #1

by Anonymous Hero on Feb 14, 2010 2:42 PM CST up reply actions  

But they are excused because of the

“Sparty, noooooo!” clause. Plus those kids in the dorm had it coming for, you know, being punchable.

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Feb 14, 2010 2:48 PM CST up reply actions  

Scott Skiles anyone?

“While in East Lansing, he was arrested and charged with felony possession of cocaine and misdemeanor possession of marijuana. The cocaine charge was dropped when Skiles pleaded guilty to the marijuana possession. He was arrested and charged with drunken driving a year later and served 15 days in jail. During his senior season, Skiles committed a parole violation on an earlier marijuana conviction, and served a brief jail sentence.” From his Wikipedia entry.

"Well of course, there's nothing better than being American!!!" - Ricky Americanzi, Jan. 5th, 2010

by The Bacon Explosion on Feb 15, 2010 11:37 AM CST up reply actions  

Are you sure

Ben Wallace didn’t edit that entry?

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Feb 15, 2010 12:04 PM CST up reply actions  

It's like I can see the future!!

Police arrested University of Oklahoma football player Austin Box after an officer saw him urinating on bar stools, according to a police report.

He was second string last year

I wasn’t even looking for football stuff and I found that link.

In 100 years, we'll all be dead.

by Flakbait on Feb 15, 2010 10:18 PM CST up reply actions  

Does anyone else remember the Wisconson player

who asaulted his girlfriend the summer before football season and wasn’t allowed to leave the state? If I remember correctly, he was allowed to play home games but couldn’t play away games. I like to think that if this happened with the Hawks he would’ve been immediately dismissed from the team. None of Iowa’s issues have been violent crimes (cab abuse not withstanding), so I think that has to be taken into account when viewing law trouble with a program as well.

"I shoot, I score. He shoots, I score." - Dan Gable

by ClaybornSmash on Feb 14, 2010 3:13 PM CST reply actions  

Um, there was this guy from Westmont, Illinois

that kind of started this whole cycle. I wish I could remember his name…

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Feb 14, 2010 3:21 PM CST up reply actions  

Also...

Abe Satterfield and Ced Everson would like to show you just how violent they can get, dawg!

I've sentenced boys younger than you to the gas chamber. Didn't want to do it. I felt I owed it to them.

-- Judge Smails

by WaterlooChazz on Feb 14, 2010 3:52 PM CST up reply actions  

Aww, I'd give him a pass OPS.

It was meant in a not-funny manner, not an “I’m trying to be funny” manner. Without the “dawg” that would be more clear.

Chazz, you shouldn’t of let that “dawg” out.

"If you want to become a man--come to Iowa" All American IOWA LB PAT ANGERER, whose best friend is a dog.

by The Director on Feb 14, 2010 6:18 PM CST up reply actions  

My bad.

And OPS is right, that is not a funny situation.

My addition of “dawg” at the end showed a more humorous attitude than I should have shown.

Again, my bad.

I've sentenced boys younger than you to the gas chamber. Didn't want to do it. I felt I owed it to them.

-- Judge Smails

by WaterlooChazz on Feb 16, 2010 10:42 PM CST up reply actions  

I remember the player, but not his name.

The “no away games” punishment was one of the weirder ones that I’ve ever seen. Maybe Bielema was afraid he was a flight risk if he crossed state lines and he was going to defect like a Cuban baseball player or something.

"I want to be a cowboy. I don't want to be a panda. Pandas are boring, stupid and boring. Bad panda!"

by RossWB on Feb 14, 2010 3:52 PM CST up reply actions  

Lance Smith

And I think the “no road games” ban was arbitrary and self-imposed. I’m pretty sure he WAS allowed to leave the state

In other words, Bielema looked at his schedule – saw the tough games were at home, and barred him from away games.

"Jack Trice Stadium - Easily one of the Top 10 Stadiums in Central Iowa"

by Not Marv Cook on Feb 14, 2010 5:18 PM CST up reply actions  

Size Matter

Something else I thought of…. Iowa City/Coralville is a fairly compact area without a lot of crime. A classic college town. Compare that to Universities in big cities where the cops are too busy to either mess with or notice the minor alcohol related offenses, at least on the weekends. Also, the players are far more anonymous. Who wants to bet that USC and UCLA guys have gotten public intox violations that just never got noticed by the press.

In 100 years, we'll all be dead.

by Flakbait on Feb 14, 2010 4:34 PM CST reply actions  

When I saw the title of this post...

I thought maybe Marc Morehouse had wronged you in some way, shape, or form.

by mattbednar on Feb 14, 2010 6:16 PM CST reply actions  

If you don't like the drinking age

blame Ronnie Reagan. On July 17, 1984, Reagan signed into law the Uniform Drinking Age Act mandating all states to adopt 21 as the legal drinking age within five years. It was based on a few highly questionable studies. Brief history here.

There are several really good books about the politics of these studies and this Act, and in short, this is a classic American hyper conservative cop out. The net effect is the infantilization of America’s youth. Just spend time in Europe and you will realize there is a better way. But…yeah, I think Iowa City cops are on the prowl.

"I’m sick of following my dreams. I’m just going to ask them where they’re going and hook up with them later." M.H.

by StoopsMyAss on Feb 14, 2010 6:22 PM CST reply actions  

I thought 19 was the perfect age.

Old enough to keep high schoolers out of bars, and in a practical sense people often waited until 19 to booze it up in college. Now, with it being 21, that so damn far off people start earlier and earlier and develop their underage strategies earlier and earlier.

At 19, bars carded EVERYONE at the door, and it worked. At 21, in order to keep business, they adopted those impossible-to-enforce rules about 18 yr olds that have about ruined the bar scene in IC.

Nineteen was the right age.

"If you want to become a man--come to Iowa" All American IOWA LB PAT ANGERER, whose best friend is a dog.

by The Director on Feb 14, 2010 6:25 PM CST up reply actions  

When it was 19

there seemed to be less concern about underage drinking in bars. The night I graduated high school, some friends and I ended up at a bar on Harrison St in Davenport drinking quarter draws. Somebody told the bartender we had just graduated that day and he gave us all free shots.

There were plenty of places that didn’t card. Now I’m friggin 40 and I get asked for my ID.

In 100 years, we'll all be dead.

by Flakbait on Feb 14, 2010 10:13 PM CST up reply actions  

Didn't that Act pass with 2/3s majority?

Or am I thinking of something else?

"...there'll be some woman, maybe 45 or 50, she'll come up and give me a hug, and I'll give my wife a wink: See? I'm not that old." - Joe Paterno

by ReadingRambler on Feb 14, 2010 11:12 PM CST up reply actions  

Probably

It’s not like any Congressman was willing to be the voice that said “NO, we should allow kids to drink” Or at least, that’s how the media/MADD portraryed it.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Feb 15, 2010 12:48 AM CST up reply actions  

I think there has been some level

of groundswell to reverse it in certain states. The sticking point (as I remember it) was not that a national drinking age could be legislated (it cannot, as alcohol regulation is a state function), but that federal transportation funds would be withheld from those states that failed to comply, in effect creating a budgetary crises through exploiting what is traditionally one of the larger state expenditures. However, a few states (both New Hampshire and Vermont, mortal enemies) have recently been weighing costs of road maintenance against lost revenue from alcohol taxes and straight-up patronage of bars and liquor stores. There are other states, Ohio for example, that take a slightly enlightened approach to the issue by allowing “underage” patrons to drink in the presence of their legal guardian. Wow, are we off on a tangent!

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Feb 15, 2010 3:20 AM CST up reply actions  

Yes

The national drinking age of 21 was tied directly to receiving federal highway funds, a law upheld by the Supreme Court in a 7-2 decision in South Dakota v. Dole where the federal government’s “suggestion” of a minimum drinking age of 21 was deemed, so exercised, to fall under Congress’ Taxing and Spending powers. I think Louisiana was the longest holdout until the mid-90s, under the calculation they received more in alcohol taxation than they would in federal highway funds. Sadly, since LA fell in line, no one has dared to break ranks.

I ate the blue ones ... they taste like burning.

by HoyaGoon on Feb 15, 2010 3:41 AM CST up reply actions  

I work late

what’s your excuse?!?

Less memorable than Sam Okey's Hawkeye career.

by Kyle McCann't on Feb 15, 2010 3:49 AM CST up reply actions  

Keep in mind that our naked capitalism is also to blame to this Act

beer companies were, and continue to be, irresponsible in how they sell their booze…essentially running an endless suppliy of commercials that suggest that hiding and hording and thus obsessing like an alcoholic over booze is how it is done. Oh yes, as with all advertising, it is a wink and a nod and very ironic and it’s fuuuuuunny. But the underlying message is consistent and relentlessly sold:

One
Two

They’re all like this, telling new drinkers “Hey, drink your fucking face off before someone finds your beer or you run out.” Sure, they’re giggly but this is why congress did/does not trust 18 year olds with booze, and you throw in a study showing they can’t make good decisions about when to get behind the wheel of a car. Done and done. As I said, it’s a cultural issue and we don’t as a society have the interest in allowing young people to behave like adults on this front beucase it would take some hard work and money (education).

"I’m sick of following my dreams. I’m just going to ask them where they’re going and hook up with them later." M.H.

by StoopsMyAss on Feb 15, 2010 7:14 AM CST up reply actions  

Ask a veteran police officer

And most of them will let you know they don’t really care who drinks or how much as long as you don’t do stupid shit while drunk. Drink a lot? That’s great, don’t be a dick in the streets outside your house/bar, don’t feel the need to beat anyone (WAG, kids most of all) and don’t for any reason drive a vehicle. Follow these simple rules and everyone is happy.

With our drinking age it is a rite of passage to spend the night of your 21st birthday passed out puking somewhere. Most other drinking nations find this very odd. If you grow up with a respect for drinking it isn’t such a magical activity. Tell anyone they can’t do something and it is all they will want to do, let them legally do it and the thrill is gone.

"Well of course, there's nothing better than being American!!!" - Ricky Americanzi, Jan. 5th, 2010

by The Bacon Explosion on Feb 15, 2010 11:34 AM CST up reply actions  

My theory, from a guy who lived in IC for a long, long time during my....

…..real good edumacation:

1. It’s a small town. ANY offense is going to hit the paper.

2. It’s a town and university that likes to make “statements,” like these:

a. No one is above the law.
b. Students drink too much alkeehol.
c. If we had our way, we would do away with freshmen eligibility and scholarships for athletes.
d. We need to meet our budget and every extra $90 helps.
e. We do not avoid the company of women, but we do deny them our essence.

I’m not so sure about “e” but the others ring true to me. The biggest factor is simply logistics: do you think a Temple FB player fined for public intox makes the front of the Philadelphia Enquirer? Not likely. That’s half the story right there.

"If you want to become a man--come to Iowa" All American IOWA LB PAT ANGERER, whose best friend is a dog.

by The Director on Feb 14, 2010 6:23 PM CST reply actions  

Yeah, it's funny. IC is a liberal enclave but the alcohol thing is a real exception

I worked at a major university for years, and evey University President is pathologically fearful of the alcohol related student death. the PR fallout is a death sentence, it mnakes the school look like a party school, not a serious academic enterprise, and it scares parents to death and they pay the bills and sign off on whether the kid attends their chosen school of not (for the most part).

 At Seton Hall a few years back a kid drank until she was so drunk her heart stopped beating. The press went nuts with the story and an investigation showed, she was not a drinker (this was like her second time), she was not hazed or egged on by fellow students, she was a novice with booze and drank so much she died. Now, if she had died from anorexia, no one would have noticed. But that is as big a problem on college campuses as excessive drinking. It is the big secret of college campuses. Bulemia and anorexia, from the stress. At the college I worked at, there were 15 girls and 2 guys in my college who had to be weighed every week in order to stay in the dorms and to stay in school, for fear their heart would stop if they lost any more weight. No one, and I mean no one, even talks about this.

Anyway, I agree that a younger age is more logical. No kid understands why the age is 21. Every other law that confirms adulthood is younger. 18 to vote, to drive, to be convicted as an adult, to be in the army, and on and on.

"I’m sick of following my dreams. I’m just going to ask them where they’re going and hook up with them later." M.H.

by StoopsMyAss on Feb 14, 2010 6:52 PM CST up reply actions  

The military is the one that gets me.

Apparently it’s a relatively frustrating thing for some of them. http://www.g2mil.com/alcohol.htm

"...there'll be some woman, maybe 45 or 50, she'll come up and give me a hug, and I'll give my wife a wink: See? I'm not that old." - Joe Paterno

by ReadingRambler on Feb 14, 2010 11:14 PM CST up reply actions  

Isn't the age to drive 16?

I mean, at 14 I had my learner’s permit. At 15 I had my school permit (school related activities/events, but I abused the shit out of that privilege) and at 16 (after driver’s ed) I had my full drivers license.

I didn’t start drinking until the end of my sophomore year in college, I was 20. However, I’ve always maintained that the only entity that suffers from lowering the drinking age is municipalities as they lose the revenue from PAULA’s/MIP’s/etc.

Black and Gold Blood: Cubbie Blue Heart

Follow me on Twitter: @MattLaCasse

by MissouriHawk on Feb 15, 2010 9:38 PM CST up reply actions  

I think now it is a probationary license...

from when you are 16 until you are 18.

I could be wrong.

I've sentenced boys younger than you to the gas chamber. Didn't want to do it. I felt I owed it to them.

-- Judge Smails

by WaterlooChazz on Feb 16, 2010 10:45 PM CST up reply actions  

Hey, what college was that?

Being nosy, if you can’t say, cool.

My blog: http://www.gretainthebox.com

by Leftcoast Hawk on Feb 15, 2010 10:51 PM CST up reply actions  

How many trendy girls can you catch at a mall?

All of you have made good (and interesting) points, but what it comes down to is shooting fish in a barrel. The simple answer is that, despite the perpetual grumblings from the city leaders, there are a metric fuckton of bars concentrated in one area. Lots of drunk people are in one area, and they’ve parked far away or walked even farther.
As has been noted, there isn’t a whole lot of tolerance for letting drunken teenagers fornicate in run around townie neighborhoods, and drunk youth don’t have a lot of advocates. Also, as was said, the university needs boosters’ and students’ parents’ $$$ support, so they advertise to the least common denominator and just try to keep anything offensive or embarrassing from ever happening… ever. So the University and Community like the ability to say, “Look Ms. Jones, it’s safe for you to send your daughter to live here for four to six years.”
But mostly it’s the money. How else would the ICPD be able to afford SWAT type equipment for their common beat-cop? In a few years they’ll be driving mini-tanks, all thanks to Courier Resident Jonny Sauce.
The student athletes who got away with everything in high school getting busted just like everyone else is just an extension of the overall love/hate relationship that IC has had with its bars for years.

by Eyeheartfreedumb on Feb 15, 2010 1:27 AM CST reply actions  

I knew Jonny Sauce

I drank with JonnySauce, Jonny Sauce was a friend of mine and freshman, you’re no Jonny Sauce.

Good point about the parents. The rise of “helicopter parenting” has probably had a big effect on University policy and by extension, Iowa City policy. “Who will monitor my darling boy and his every move”. Well, how about your darling boy. College is also about learning to take care of yourself. Sometimes Jonny is gonna get blasted and Sally may decide getting double teamed is a good idea. I came so close to getting killed by a Cambus as I stumbled home one night it isn’t even funny. In the end, you just gotta hope the luck holds out and they make it through without injury, disease or a bun in the oven. It’s called growing up.

In 100 years, we'll all be dead.

by Flakbait on Feb 15, 2010 8:09 AM CST up reply actions  

Trendy Girls in Courier

They simply ask their roommate nicely to “please sleep in someone else’s room” when you come back to her dorm room for that special kind of nightcap. At least, that’s what the girl I met at a mixer, went downtown, drank a pitcher of beer, did we when got back from the bar.

As for the Cambus incident you describe, I’d rather do the Walk of Shame the next morning than get flattened by a Cambus avoiding the Walk of Shame (although there’s always the Sunday Morning Ride of Shame).

My blog: http://www.gretainthebox.com

by Leftcoast Hawk on Feb 15, 2010 10:49 PM CST up reply actions  

Yeah

That was the night I learned to:
A) Don’t drink so damn much
B) Know where you can crash so you don’t have to stumble all the way across town when you do drink so damn much.

In 100 years, we'll all be dead.

by Flakbait on Feb 16, 2010 8:00 AM CST up reply actions  

One Question.
I have often wondered about the arrests, DUI’s, public intoxication, etc. that seem to have followed the two major programs at Iowa for over a decade now.

There are problems with arrests in the wrestling program?

I know, that was kind of a cheap shot.

by Abbas_Cincinnatus on Feb 15, 2010 9:17 AM CST reply actions  

No

Because if there was ever a sport that self-polices, it would be wrestling.

I don’t remember the specifics, but there was a Iowa wrestler recently that was dumber than words and stole some $3 item from a hardware store. I would wager that said wrestler was punished by Brands as though he’d just assaulted his sister, and said wrestler will never make such a dumb mistake again (and neither will any of the other wrestlers after witnessing the punishment)

The cultural environment of wrestling isn’t like football or basketball, where the players are often coddled and catered to. Wrestlers, and often their parents as well, expect the coach to beat the hell out of them. In football, while I don’t condone the conduct, a coach gets fired for slapping a player, or putting him in a dark room, etc.

by benvious on Feb 15, 2010 10:35 AM CST up reply actions  

This

Yeah – I think this sums it up. Hat tip to Hawkeye State.

He Stole an “I’m With Stupid” Shirt that Pointed at Himself. Joe Slaton, a senior wrestler and possible starter at 133 pounds next season (you’ll have to ask RossWB just how likely that second part might be) was arrested Sunday morning for shoplifting from Paul’s Discount in Iowa City. For those of you not familiar with the area, Paul’s Discount looks like a flea market and sells just about everything; it’s basically Farm & Fleet with a more colorful sign. I would say Slaton was caught grabbing a Carhartt jacket, but I always assumed he fashioned his clothing from the hides of other wrestlers he had killed in combat.

I can see the preliminary hearing now: The judge picks up the file, looks at Slaton, and asks, “Aren’t you a wrestler for the university?” Slaton responds in the affirmative. The judge looks to the back of the courtroom and sees Tom Brands, teeth clinched, face red, eyes bulging from his head. He wryly chuckles and gives Slaton a small fine, saying, “I can’t do anything to top what Brands is going to do to you. We have an Eighth Amendment to follow. He doesn’t.”

by benvious on Feb 15, 2010 10:40 AM CST up reply actions  

Paul's discount is still open?

Wow. That place has always looked like its going out of biz, I guess.

And stealing a cheap t-shirt was a super dumbfuck move.

My blog: http://www.gretainthebox.com

by Leftcoast Hawk on Feb 15, 2010 10:46 PM CST up reply actions  

There are different version

of what happened down at Texas Tech with the “dark room” incident. The sides can’t even agree on how to describe the shed.

Anyway,

That was regarding treatment of a player after a possible concussion and was very poorly handled. I don’t know that the coach deserved to be fired though. Disciplinary matters are a different subject.

I used to work with a former Iowa westler. No idea who it was. Anyway, he would do pushups in the office. Sets of 10, about once an hour.

In 100 years, we'll all be dead.

by Flakbait on Feb 15, 2010 10:42 AM CST up reply actions  

I do that in my cubicle

Because I’m a manly man.

My blog: http://www.gretainthebox.com

by Leftcoast Hawk on Feb 15, 2010 10:52 PM CST up reply actions  

Has it occured to anyone KF is simply doing the right thing.

I’m sure Hayden Fry’s way made sense back then. With technolgy today somebody somewhere has video or a picture of it anyway if it happended in downtown IC. If a coach were to do it the good ol boy way, there is a good chance he would get busted somewhere down the line. KF and staff are too smart to try to do anything other than the way the school and authorities say it should be and I commend them for it.

by ChryslerKinnick on Feb 15, 2010 11:12 AM CST reply actions  

They probably are doing the right thing.

The initial question posed is whether the Iowa City and U of I police are busting kids for misbehavior that would be excused elsewhere. I don’t think that question is very useful. I think the better question would be this – why do some students abuse alcohol (regularly) and commit crimes, however petty? A good follow up question would be this – isn’t self-discipline a trait that we should demand from all university athletes? Finally, a comment – alcohol is a drug. A legal and socially-condoned drug, of course, but still a drug that is addictive, impairs judgment, and is sometimes deadly. Can anyone deny that the culture of HEAVY alcohol consumption in Iowa City and many other college towns is something that should be changed, if possible? Do we want college students to develop a habit of binge drinking that they may find difficult to stop after graduation?

by Binator on Feb 15, 2010 12:55 PM CST reply actions  

I think the point is that binge drinking is a byproduct of America's attitude toward alcohol...

Food is a legal and socially condoned drug. Obesity is now the number one killer of Americans, it has taken over tobacco. Alcohol is actually well behind those two. Most things you consume, if you consume them in anything other than moderation, they will hurt you. But in America we have a double standard about alcohol. The average 35 year old in America consumes far less alcohol than the average EU citizen. But, our 19 year olds consume much more than the EU counterpart. Hmmm….

"I’m sick of following my dreams. I’m just going to ask them where they’re going and hook up with them later." M.H.

by StoopsMyAss on Feb 15, 2010 1:18 PM CST up reply actions  

A drug?

I agree that many people regularly overeat and can develop an addiction to food. And your overarching point that we’re missing the forest for the trees when it comes to 19 year-olds getting drunk and doing something stupid is still very valid. I just think classifying food as a drug is a stretch.

by Abbas_Cincinnatus on Feb 15, 2010 2:15 PM CST up reply actions  

The Food and Drug Administration

share offices for a reason my friend. But, yes, technically food is not a drug, but caffeine is a drug and last I checked, the biggest abusers of that are college kids and truckers.

"I’m sick of following my dreams. I’m just going to ask them where they’re going and hook up with them later." M.H.

by StoopsMyAss on Feb 15, 2010 3:46 PM CST up reply actions  

Did you just say....truckers?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80v5Wueed10

I have an addiction, yesssir, and I am proud.

"...there'll be some woman, maybe 45 or 50, she'll come up and give me a hug, and I'll give my wife a wink: See? I'm not that old." - Joe Paterno

by ReadingRambler on Feb 15, 2010 7:37 PM CST up reply actions  

Nothing like a well shaven, but wired American trucker!

"I’m sick of following my dreams. I’m just going to ask them where they’re going and hook up with them later." M.H.

by StoopsMyAss on Feb 15, 2010 8:06 PM CST up reply actions  

I remain unconvinced that a goodly number of kids in college are going to heed suggestions that they take it easy on the alcohol. I’m not saying they shouldn’t, but let’s live in the real world for a bit. Being in college has some element of stupidity, in my experience. There but for the grace of god, and whatnot.

A different issue posed here is a suggestion the IC police look to make hay on the ever popular walking while impaired charge. I think on many campuses in relatively smaller towns there’s a huge schmism between the town police and U police. My daughter visited her college of choice in the NE this weekend (she’s been admitted for next fall) and was warned expilicitly that if she is stopped in town for any offense, real or imagined, she ask to be turned over to the campus gendarmes. On this campus, the local fellas are failed staties with legendarily bad attitudes. The current generation of IC police sound like they have a similar profile.

by txhawkeye on Feb 15, 2010 9:51 PM CST up reply actions  

Nothing has changed... the IC cops were the same in the 1980s

Its just with the internet there’s a lot more publicity.

My blog: http://www.gretainthebox.com

by Leftcoast Hawk on Feb 15, 2010 10:45 PM CST up reply actions  

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